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Post by SpydancerLovesVincat on Sept 12, 2014 16:01:26 GMT -5
Since this is the everything thread, I'm going to share an unpopular opinion. I have lived - for nearly the entire last year - straddling the fence between loving and hating this show. The problem for people like me (because I know I'm not alone) is that I still care, despite the fact that the second season was an enormous disappointment, I have never gotten over the fact that I care. That is the only reason I'm still here.
I was an early fan, and I loved this board. But as the show has progressed, and the fandom has divided, it has not always been the most welcoming place. As the second season unfolded, and the disappointment spread through the fandom, I watched many go dark on the board, their light of love for the show extinguished. As the gap widened and fans divided further, it feels like some bad juju spread through the board. I find it sad to see so much sarcasm and borderline ridicule. I say that for a number of reasons, but first and foremost, because two wrongs do not make a right. This is a supposed to be a place that we come to to share our opinions and viewpoints - even unpopular ones - and make friends, not a place where group think and ridicule drives those who are different away. Whatever we may or may not be, we should not be ruled by savagery. Although I have not been the target of sarcasm or ridicule of late, I have experienced it before, and at times when I was just trying to share my feelings, not when I had said anything or done anything to be offensive to anyone. So whether or not such behavior is warranted, is a moot point in my book. We do not better ourselves by being unkind, and as a fandom, everything we have been through together should make us stronger, not drive us to ostracizing or ridiculing someone who offends us in some way or says something we don't like. (I use "us" and "we" generally of course). Whatever I have or have not accomplished with this post, I will say my intent is this: Be kind, always. Love is always the right answer.
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Sept 12, 2014 16:31:27 GMT -5
Since this is the everything thread, I'm going to share an unpopular opinion. I have lived - for nearly the entire last year - straddling the fence between loving and hating this show. The problem for people like me (because I know I'm not alone) is that I still care, despite the fact that the second season was an enormous disappointment, I have never gotten over the fact that I care. That is the only reason I'm still here. I was an early fan, and I loved this board. But as the show has progressed, and the fandom has divided, it has not always been the most welcoming place. As the second season unfolded, and the disappointment spread through the fandom, I watched many go dark on the board, their light of love for the show extinguished. As the gap widened and fans divided further, it feels like some bad juju spread through the board. I find it sad to see so much sarcasm and borderline ridicule. I say that for a number of reasons, but first and foremost, because two wrongs do not make a right. This is a supposed to be a place that we come to to share our opinions and viewpoints - even unpopular ones - and make friends, not a place where group think and ridicule drives those who are different away. Whatever we may or may not be, we should not be ruled by savagery. Although I have not been the target of sarcasm or ridicule of late, I have experienced it before, and at times when I was just trying to share my feelings, not when I had said anything or done anything to be offensive to anyone. So whether or not such behavior is warranted, is a moot point in my book. We do not better ourselves by being unkind, and as a fandom, everything we have been through together should make us stronger, not drive us to ostracizing or ridiculing someone who offends us in some way or says something we don't like. (I use "us" and "we" generally of course). Whatever I have or have not accomplished with this post, I will say my intent is this: Be kind, always. Love is always the right answer. You have a point to an extent BUT as your dislike with the show is more of the plots...triangles and character (s) assassinations. .Some have taken sides between V and C and JR and KK. Again I say I'm not into the show for neither of the actors I'm in it for BEAUTY AND THE BEAST. One can not exist without the other. Telling of stories are all about them not just one or the other and then people say it's Vincent centric or Catherine centric. .I see ALL episodes are ALWAYS about THEM not just the one. And that's where the discussion always gets steamy and the subject becomes a problem. Separation of the fandom is not solely cause of lack of KK and Catherine centric episodes ..it's every other thing too. JMHO of course. On a lighter note nice to see you around SpydancerLovesVincat been a while! How You's doing?? |
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Post by SpydancerLovesVincat on Sept 12, 2014 17:04:39 GMT -5
Since this is the everything thread, I'm going to share an unpopular opinion. I have lived - for nearly the entire last year - straddling the fence between loving and hating this show. The problem for people like me (because I know I'm not alone) is that I still care, despite the fact that the second season was an enormous disappointment, I have never gotten over the fact that I care. That is the only reason I'm still here. I was an early fan, and I loved this board. But as the show has progressed, and the fandom has divided, it has not always been the most welcoming place. As the second season unfolded, and the disappointment spread through the fandom, I watched many go dark on the board, their light of love for the show extinguished. As the gap widened and fans divided further, it feels like some bad juju spread through the board. I find it sad to see so much sarcasm and borderline ridicule. I say that for a number of reasons, but first and foremost, because two wrongs do not make a right. This is a supposed to be a place that we come to to share our opinions and viewpoints - even unpopular ones - and make friends, not a place where group think and ridicule drives those who are different away. Whatever we may or may not be, we should not be ruled by savagery. Although I have not been the target of sarcasm or ridicule of late, I have experienced it before, and at times when I was just trying to share my feelings, not when I had said anything or done anything to be offensive to anyone. So whether or not such behavior is warranted, is a moot point in my book. We do not better ourselves by being unkind, and as a fandom, everything we have been through together should make us stronger, not drive us to ostracizing or ridiculing someone who offends us in some way or says something we don't like. (I use "us" and "we" generally of course). Whatever I have or have not accomplished with this post, I will say my intent is this: Be kind, always. Love is always the right answer. You have a point to an extent BUT as your dislike with the show is more of the plots...triangles and character (s) assassinations. .Some have taken sides between V and C and JR and KK. Again I say I'm not into the show for neither of the actors I'm in it for BEAUTY AND THE BEAST. One can not exist without the other. Telling of stories are all about them not just one or the other and then people say it's Vincent centric or Catherine centric. .I see ALL episodes are ALWAYS about THEM not just the one. And that's where the discussion always gets steamy and the subject becomes a problem. Separation of the fandom is not solely cause of lack of KK and Catherine centric episodes ..it's every other thing too. JMHO of course. On a lighter note nice to see you around SpydancerLovesVincat been a while! How You's doing?? I mean, I understand, I'm just saying, let's be kind to one another. Even if someone, anyone really, is blatantly wrong, jumping on a bandwagon and using sarcasm and/or ridicule is not the best way to handle it. This is not the place for schoolyard level bullying, and sometimes I think we toe the line around here... As someone who has been the subject, and probably when it WAS just as plain as schoolyard or juvenile bullying, I'm just saying we are better for taking the high road, always! Doing well. Getting VERY pregnant. 30 weeks yesterday !! How are you? Hoping that "life" will get in the way of being a spoiler addict this time around. Plus, I have no "deep" thoughts to contribute to the continued debates... About S2. Alot of it is pretty shallow (to me) and I just sound like a broken record anyway. I can't find all of the hidden meaning and justification for everything and I'm kind of tired of reading about it. Plus I'm usually either working, sleeping, eating, or headed to the Dr. Office :-)). Looking forward to my baby shower this week-end!! |
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Sept 12, 2014 17:13:12 GMT -5
You have a point to an extent BUT as your dislike with the show is more of the plots...triangles and character (s) assassinations. .Some have taken sides between V and C and JR and KK. Again I say I'm not into the show for neither of the actors I'm in it for BEAUTY AND THE BEAST. One can not exist without the other. Telling of stories are all about them not just one or the other and then people say it's Vincent centric or Catherine centric. .I see ALL episodes are ALWAYS about THEM not just the one. And that's where the discussion always gets steamy and the subject becomes a problem. Separation of the fandom is not solely cause of lack of KK and Catherine centric episodes ..it's every other thing too. JMHO of course. On a lighter note nice to see you around SpydancerLovesVincat been a while! How You's doing?? I mean, I understand, I'm just saying, let's be kind to one another. Even if someone, anyone really, is blatantly wrong, jumping on a bandwagon and using sarcasm and/or ridicule is not the best way to handle it. This is not the place for schoolyard level bullying, and sometimes I think we toe the line around here... As someone who has been the subject, and probably when it WAS just as plain as schoolyard or juvenile bullying, I'm just saying we are better for taking the high road, always! Doing well. Getting VERY pregnant. 30 weeks yesterday !! How are you? Hoping that "life" will get in the way of being a spoiler addict this time around. Plus, I have no "deep" thoughts to contribute to the continued debates... About S2. Alot of it is pretty shallow (to me) and I just sound like a broken record anyway. I can't find all of the hidden meaning and justification for everything and I'm kind of tired of reading about it. Plus I'm usually either working, sleeping, eating, or headed to the Dr. Office :-)). Looking forward to my baby shower this week-end!! Being very pregnant is GOOD! LOL I'm still a spoiler junkie lol..I still have my little birds that sing  and my gut is always telling me stuff too You have other stuff happening and your focus is elsewhere and it's where it should be. My grandson was here with me the whole summer left the 29th to start school I didn't have much time then to ponder on seeking spoilers but now same old lol...hence how I found the title to 301 over a month before it was confirmed today my detective skills are still sharp lol Have fun at your baby shower ...hope you get everything you need! Don't be a stranger  |
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Post by wanderer on Sept 12, 2014 23:51:42 GMT -5
Haven't been here for a while because of holidays and poorly parents....... good to be back! But what do you know Dan bemoaning the apparent lack of Catherine in a season that hasn't been filmed yet..... Beastinthehouse winding Beasties up with his underwear model and general snippy comments about our beloved BATB. Wash, Rinse, Repeat or is it Same Old, Same Old? I too am baffled by the notion of continuing to watch something that you have such negativity about. Life is too short I am not advocating that anyone stop watching.......just cannot see the point if you have nothing good to say....... No one knows what the future holds, if these are the last episodes then I for one am determined to enjoy the ride. But it ain't over til the fat lady sing (whoever she may be) All just my opinion of course. I agree and I've wondered the same thing. The only other forum I read is a college football forum.On that forum there are "alleged" fans that post inflammatory comments just to incite the fan base. The fans actually have a name for them: trolls. Usually, they are fans of other colleges pretending to be fans of the forum college. I'm not saying anyone here is posting just for the "fun" of upsetting the BATB fans, but, like you, I wonder why dissatisfied people keep coming back. |
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Post by wanderer on Sept 12, 2014 23:55:13 GMT -5
And I'm not talking about Spydancer, who loves the show but was disappointed in season 2. In fact, I agreed with most everything she's said.
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Post by Mrs Forbes Glass Half Full on Sept 13, 2014 14:44:25 GMT -5
Since this is the everything thread, I'm going to share an unpopular opinion. I have lived - for nearly the entire last year - straddling the fence between loving and hating this show. The problem for people like me (because I know I'm not alone) is that I still care, despite the fact that the second season was an enormous disappointment, I have never gotten over the fact that I care. That is the only reason I'm still here. I was an early fan, and I loved this board. But as the show has progressed, and the fandom has divided, it has not always been the most welcoming place. As the second season unfolded, and the disappointment spread through the fandom, I watched many go dark on the board, their light of love for the show extinguished. As the gap widened and fans divided further, it feels like some bad juju spread through the board. I find it sad to see so much sarcasm and borderline ridicule. I say that for a number of reasons, but first and foremost, because two wrongs do not make a right. This is a supposed to be a place that we come to to share our opinions and viewpoints - even unpopular ones - and make friends, not a place where group think and ridicule drives those who are different away. Whatever we may or may not be, we should not be ruled by savagery. Although I have not been the target of sarcasm or ridicule of late, I have experienced it before, and at times when I was just trying to share my feelings, not when I had said anything or done anything to be offensive to anyone. So whether or not such behavior is warranted, is a moot point in my book. We do not better ourselves by being unkind, and as a fandom, everything we have been through together should make us stronger, not drive us to ostracizing or ridiculing someone who offends us in some way or says something we don't like. (I use "us" and "we" generally of course). Whatever I have or have not accomplished with this post, I will say my intent is this: Be kind, always. Love is always the right answer. Agree with your sentiments entirely I think sometimes the problem is that text doesn't allow for nuances in tone or expression. The written word doesn't always allow for humor to shine through. I, by nature and nationality am slightly sarcastic. I would be mortified if any of my posts upset anyone. But......... this is a place where people express their views on all things BATB. It is a passionate fanbase and fans have become defensive when it has been such an uphill battle from the beginning. I personally love the show, although I am not a huge fan of season 2 in comparison to season 1. I agree with a lot of the criticism leveled at it. However, I also love certain new elements that it added. But, hand on heart, am baffled why any person who is constantly dissatisfied with the show continues to watch and then post negativity!!! I get constructive criticism. I don't get constant complaining. If BATB was a constant disappointment i would stop watching and coming to a BATB board. (Not that I am implying anyone should do that........hell no) Sooooo looking forward to Season 3 !!!!!  |
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Post by dan on Sept 13, 2014 18:56:00 GMT -5
Since this is the everything thread, I'm going to share an unpopular opinion. I have lived - for nearly the entire last year - straddling the fence between loving and hating this show. The problem for people like me (because I know I'm not alone) is that I still care, despite the fact that the second season was an enormous disappointment, I have never gotten over the fact that I care. That is the only reason I'm still here. I was an early fan, and I loved this board. But as the show has progressed, and the fandom has divided, it has not always been the most welcoming place. As the second season unfolded, and the disappointment spread through the fandom, I watched many go dark on the board, their light of love for the show extinguished. As the gap widened and fans divided further, it feels like some bad juju spread through the board. I find it sad to see so much sarcasm and borderline ridicule. I say that for a number of reasons, but first and foremost, because two wrongs do not make a right. This is a supposed to be a place that we come to to share our opinions and viewpoints - even unpopular ones - and make friends, not a place where group think and ridicule drives those who are different away. Whatever we may or may not be, we should not be ruled by savagery. Although I have not been the target of sarcasm or ridicule of late, I have experienced it before, and at times when I was just trying to share my feelings, not when I had said anything or done anything to be offensive to anyone. So whether or not such behavior is warranted, is a moot point in my book. We do not better ourselves by being unkind, and as a fandom, everything we have been through together should make us stronger, not drive us to ostracizing or ridiculing someone who offends us in some way or says something we don't like. (I use "us" and "we" generally of course). Whatever I have or have not accomplished with this post, I will say my intent is this: Be kind, always. Love is always the right answer. Nah, I don't really blame them. For all the ridicules,eventhough I did feel like my posts were being laughed at,bullied & making fun of,it's all been Forgiven.I never really hold any grudge for it. But I do still kinda blame TPTB,that's where all this team Cat vs team Vincent came from. All of those 10 episodes where they all focused on Vincent and his dramas at the start of season two should have been followed by another 10 episodes of Cat centric where revolved on her stories instead.But no,they just had to give one character way more arcs than another. It's that kind of FAVORITISM that divided this fandom. It should have been Beauty and the Beast Not the Beast and his beauty. To add insult to the injustice,In addition of being given more stories to his character one actor seems to always get way more praises and appreciations for his works than the other actress in this fandom. I've seen that everywhere If you want to fix something, fix what Is broken, instead of keep in denial about it. |
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Post by raniamahd on Sept 14, 2014 5:26:00 GMT -5
Fourth contention: was the comment regarding the actor. While calling someone an underwear model actually isn't too insulting to me, we don't attack one another directly or the actors that play the roles as no one likes or appreciates insults. Good morning and sorry to interfere here , i try hard not to interfere in some discussions because i consider myself a guest to the board and to the show viewers , and guests should know their limits and behave well , although all friends here are great but i try not to take advantage of their good hospitality , but being from another culture sometime makes things puzzled and confusing for me ? so i have to ask for explanation ! you see i don't find referring to an actor be saying ( he looks like underwear model ) insulting ? even more i find it exactly the opposite in Jay's case ! i read that comment about him in some article when the show first started and it was obvious the article's writer meant it as an insult ? so i was very confused ? yes he is a very good looking man ( you have to be blind to not notice that lol ) so what ? the only case that would undermine him if he is a bad actor because you can't act just because you are beautiful ? you need to be talent too , the same way you need to have a beautiful voice in the first place to sing , you can't sing just because you are beautiful (unfortunately some people do lol) but in Jay's case he is a very talent actor too , he proved himself very well to be a good actor too so its a perfect mix for actor /actress to be both gorgeous and talent in the same time ! in my culture this consider as a compliment ? if you tell an actor/actress he/she is gorgeous and talent he/she would be very flattered ! so can someone explain to me why some people mean it as an insult referring to Jay ? how could it be ? thanks |
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Post by Mrs Forbes Glass Half Full on Sept 14, 2014 7:55:39 GMT -5
Fourth contention: was the comment regarding the actor. While calling someone an underwear model actually isn't too insulting to me, we don't attack one another directly or the actors that play the roles as no one likes or appreciates insults. Good morning and sorry to interfere here , i try hard not to interfere in some discussions because i consider myself a guest to the board and to the show viewers , and guests should know their limits and behave well , although all friends here are great but i try not to take advantage of their good hospitality , but being from another culture sometime makes things puzzled and confusing for me ? so i have to ask for explanation ! you see i don't find referring to an actor be saying ( he looks like underwear model ) insulting ? even more i find it exactly the opposite in Jay's case ! i read that comment about him in some article when the show first started and it was obvious the article's writer meant it as an insult ? so i was very confused ? yes he is a very good looking man ( you have to be blind to not notice that lol ) so what ? the only case that would undermine him if he is a bad actor because you can't act just because you are beautiful ? you need to be talent too , the same way you need to have a beautiful voice in the first place to sing , you can't sing just because you are beautiful (unfortunately some people do lol) but in Jay's case he is a very talent actor too , he proved himself very well to be a good actor too so its a perfect mix for actor /actress to be both gorgeous and talent in the same time ! in my culture this consider as a compliment ? if you tell an actor/actress he/she is gorgeous and talent he/she would be very flattered ! so can someone explain to me why some people mean it as an insult referring to Jay ? how could it be ? thanks Its all about tone and context. Calling someone a 'Swimwear model' is not necessarily an insult, like you said, it can be a lovely compliment.. However, if it is said in a way that implies that that is all that person/character is, then it is not meant (IMHO) as a compliment. It reduces that person/character to a superficial level, negating what that person has achieved apart from their appearance. No insult intended to any Swimwear Model, in fact I wish I had the figure to be one, but at 49 and a short-ass, that ship never came into port.... Like I said... it's all about context and I suppose interpretation. Other people may have a totally different outlook on the situation. This is my opinion only. Hope it helps.... |
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Post by raniamahd on Sept 14, 2014 8:33:29 GMT -5
Good morning and sorry to interfere here , i try hard not to interfere in some discussions because i consider myself a guest to the board and to the show viewers , and guests should know their limits and behave well , although all friends here are great but i try not to take advantage of their good hospitality , but being from another culture sometime makes things puzzled and confusing for me ? so i have to ask for explanation ! you see i don't find referring to an actor be saying ( he looks like underwear model ) insulting ? even more i find it exactly the opposite in Jay's case ! i read that comment about him in some article when the show first started and it was obvious the article's writer meant it as an insult ? so i was very confused ? yes he is a very good looking man ( you have to be blind to not notice that lol ) so what ? the only case that would undermine him if he is a bad actor because you can't act just because you are beautiful ? you need to be talent too , the same way you need to have a beautiful voice in the first place to sing , you can't sing just because you are beautiful (unfortunately some people do lol) but in Jay's case he is a very talent actor too , he proved himself very well to be a good actor too so its a perfect mix for actor /actress to be both gorgeous and talent in the same time ! in my culture this consider as a compliment ? if you tell an actor/actress he/she is gorgeous and talent he/she would be very flattered ! so can someone explain to me why some people mean it as an insult referring to Jay ? how could it be ? thanks Its all about tone and context. Calling someone a 'Swimwear model' is not necessarily an insult, like you said, it can be a lovely compliment.. However, if it is said in a way that implies that that is all that person/character is, then it is not meant (IMHO) as a compliment. It reduces that person/character to a superficial level, negating what that person has achieved apart from their appearance. No insult intended to any Swimwear Model, in fact I wish I had the figure to be one, but at 49 and a short-ass, that ship never came into port.... Like I said... it's all about context and I suppose interpretation. Other people may have a totally different outlook on the situation. This is my opinion only. Hope it helps.... yes that helped thank you and as you said it isn't insulting to look like a model , God i know i wish i am ! but for a middle age woman and a mother of three kids its just impossible  and i also get that it would be insulting if it means that person has nothing but his outer look ! because as beautiful as it is to dream about having the body of a model girl i would never dream of trade it with my real life and what i accomplished in it ! so to return to the people who say that about Jay as an insult i think the joke is on them this time because he is both good looking and good actor too |
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Post by SpydancerLovesVincat on Sept 14, 2014 8:55:11 GMT -5
Since this is the everything thread, I'm going to share an unpopular opinion. I have lived - for nearly the entire last year - straddling the fence between loving and hating this show. The problem for people like me (because I know I'm not alone) is that I still care, despite the fact that the second season was an enormous disappointment, I have never gotten over the fact that I care. That is the only reason I'm still here. I was an early fan, and I loved this board. But as the show has progressed, and the fandom has divided, it has not always been the most welcoming place. As the second season unfolded, and the disappointment spread through the fandom, I watched many go dark on the board, their light of love for the show extinguished. As the gap widened and fans divided further, it feels like some bad juju spread through the board. I find it sad to see so much sarcasm and borderline ridicule. I say that for a number of reasons, but first and foremost, because two wrongs do not make a right. This is a supposed to be a place that we come to to share our opinions and viewpoints - even unpopular ones - and make friends, not a place where group think and ridicule drives those who are different away. Whatever we may or may not be, we should not be ruled by savagery. Although I have not been the target of sarcasm or ridicule of late, I have experienced it before, and at times when I was just trying to share my feelings, not when I had said anything or done anything to be offensive to anyone. So whether or not such behavior is warranted, is a moot point in my book. We do not better ourselves by being unkind, and as a fandom, everything we have been through together should make us stronger, not drive us to ostracizing or ridiculing someone who offends us in some way or says something we don't like. (I use "us" and "we" generally of course). Whatever I have or have not accomplished with this post, I will say my intent is this: Be kind, always. Love is always the right answer. Agree with your sentiments entirely I think sometimes the problem is that text doesn't allow for nuances in tone or expression. The written word doesn't always allow for humor to shine through. I, by nature and nationality am slightly sarcastic. I would be mortified if any of my posts upset anyone. But......... this is a place where people express their views on all things BATB. It is a passionate fanbase and fans have become defensive when it has been such an uphill battle from the beginning. I personally love the show, although I am not a huge fan of season 2 in comparison to season 1. I agree with a lot of the criticism leveled at it. However, I also love certain new elements that it added. But, hand on heart, am baffled why any person who is constantly dissatisfied with the show continues to watch and then post negativity!!! I get constructive criticism. I don't get constant complaining. If BATB was a constant disappointment i would stop watching and coming to a BATB board. (Not that I am implying anyone should do that........hell no) Sooooo looking forward to Season 3 !!!!! You are absolutely right about the written word not allowing for humor to shine through. Sometimes I have used humor or sarcasm in a joking way, for dramatic effect, and have gotten in trouble for it. I guess some things are taken seriously, though, no matter what the original intent was. And as much as I love(d) the show, S2 ruined a lot of things for me, so I get the negativity. The creative mistakes and the plot devices, dragged on and on and on, to the point -almost- of no return. I think fans, like me, even though I still watch, will never be the same. There is something important, a promise, of what the original premise that was created, which was broken. You can't fix that, no matter how hard you try, not for me at least. So I understand continual negativity. But in all honesty, this isn't about what I think, I'm just saying that I relate to disgruntled fans in general. Also, having said that, I can say that every time there is sarcasm or ridicule going on on this board, is not always related to people who may or may not be "trolling" or making inflammatory statements, it may just be when someone posts something that someone else disagrees with. And then a "mob" type of mentality sets in and a small group of people may choose to directly or indirectly make that person feel unwelcome either by using sarcasm or ridicule, or both. This type of behavior reminds me of junior high school, and ultimately leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I mean, I understand both sides, but if you suspect someone is trolling intentionally or trying to stir the pot, why not just take the high road? Personally I find some of the creative choices made in S2 reprehensible, and it was hard to defend the show after that. I say debate away, just be nice to one another. That's all. |
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Post by jefferen on Sept 15, 2014 8:50:20 GMT -5
This is a reply to sunshine's post in Spoilers 301, but its a little off topic of 301 so I am posting it here I feel just the opposite about S1. Vincat 3.0 from 215 til 222 is my favorite. I think V self worth/ self esteem was a problem w/ VinCat 1.0. He lacked confidence too and it showed. I loved the swooning lines and the little moments between VinCat, but I kinda got annoyed after awhile with V always playing pity party and not having the confidence and self esteem to really believe that he deserved Catherine. Also IMO, I dont think that w/ the exception of Muirfield (which has always been a problem, even before VinCat got together) and Gabe, Vincat 1.0 imo, didn't have the opportunity to see how strong their relationship actually was or go through anything that major or big to know if they would survive and be able to withstand it. If it was Cat that got kidnapped at the end of S1 imo i dont think Vincent wouldve survived. I dont think he wouldve been able to hold on long enough to do what needed to be done to save Catherine, especially because in S1 he always felt so undeserving of Catherine. Vincent's kidnapping at the end of S1 changed everything. And when they finally did, in S2 after they find V and hes lost all his memories, and hes tetering on Man or Beast constantly because of his memory loss that slowly started to tear them apart. It didnt finally cultivate until Cat shot him. That was the arc that that truly tested them. Through the period of after Cat shot him, up until 211 when V finally realizes that he can trust Cat and he wants to be the man worthy enough of her love, VinCat is literally a mess. Because of the pull thats between VinCat/Jaystin (that even at odds is still smacking us in our face) I knew eventually that they would prevail, but I wasnt sure how long it was actually gonna take. And i loved watching VinCat work their way back to each other. Even when they were fighting, there were times I was waiting for their fights to break into passion. It was obvious to me at least, even if it wasnt to them yet, that regardless of what was going on between them that they were still our VinCat and underneath everything and still cared and loved each other despite everything. If what happened in S2 happened in S1 to VinCat I feel pretty confident to say that I dont think or believe that VinCat wouldve made it. And not to say that I like VinCat being apart or with other people, cause I really dont, but I think it needed to happen. They needed something that big to test their love and boundaries and to experience other people so they could truly figure out their destiny. Its about them being able to chose that destiny despite everything that has happened and realizing that its still what they want and that the love they share is worth fighting for. And let me just say, it the "other people" VinCat chose were definitely not the right people to have tried to experience the other side of things, it was definitely executed very poorly, but I understand and get why it happened. When VinCat finally come back together they are stronger imo. Just like Cat said about everything they went through makes them stronger as a couple. If the manhunt for V happened in S1, the kidnapping, and Gabe hurting all those innocent people (the only 1 he was trying 2 hurt on S1 was just V) but S2, IT WAS Heather, JT, the reporter, Agent Knox, Cat if that happened in S1 ontop of V's self worth issues and confidence I think he wouldve bolted and really left Catherine. He never really felt like he deserved Catherine in S1. But by the time VinCat comes back together in S2, V feels worthy and confident of everything he has and deserves and it obvious on screen. And you can tell that nothing and no one will get in his way of his happily ever after with Cat and that he isnt going to be running anywhere. He wants Catherine and their life together and knows it might not be smooth sailing, but they deserve a future and wont back down because of an obstacle and that whatever gets in the way of them, they will overcome it and it will be VinCat in the end. And that is what I love so much about VinCat 3.0. I didnt feel like that in S1 when I refer to VinCat being unbreakable. |
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Post by BeastieBoy on Sept 15, 2014 13:03:23 GMT -5
This is a reply to sunshine's post in Spoilers 301, but its a little off topic of 301 so I am posting it here I feel just the opposite about S1. Vincat 3.0 from 215 til 222 is my favorite. I think V self worth/ self esteem was a problem w/ VinCat 1.0. He lacked confidence too and it showed. I loved the swooning lines and the little moments between VinCat, but I kinda got annoyed after awhile with V always playing pity party and not having the confidence and self esteem to really believe that he deserved Catherine. Also IMO, I dont think that w/ the exception of Muirfield (which has always been a problem, even before VinCat got together) and Gabe, Vincat 1.0 imo, didn't have the opportunity to see how strong their relationship actually was or go through anything that major or big to know if they would survive and be able to withstand it. If it was Cat that got kidnapped at the end of S1 imo i dont think Vincent wouldve survived. I dont think he wouldve been able to hold on long enough to do what needed to be done to save Catherine, especially because in S1 he always felt so undeserving of Catherine. Vincent's kidnapping at the end of S1 changed everything. And when they finally did, in S2 after they find V and hes lost all his memories, and hes tetering on Man or Beast constantly because of his memory loss that slowly started to tear them apart. It didnt finally cultivate until Cat shot him. That was the arc that that truly tested them. Through the period of after Cat shot him, up until 211 when V finally realizes that he can trust Cat and he wants to be the man worthy enough of her love, VinCat is literally a mess. Because of the pull thats between VinCat/Jaystin (that even at odds is still smacking us in our face) I knew eventually that they would prevail, but I wasnt sure how long it was actually gonna take. And i loved watching VinCat work their way back to each other. Even when they were fighting, there were times I was waiting for their fights to break into passion. It was obvious to me at least, even if it wasnt to them yet, that regardless of what was going on between them that they were still our VinCat and underneath everything and still cared and loved each other despite everything. If what happened in S2 happened in S1 to VinCat I feel pretty confident to say that I dont think or believe that VinCat wouldve made it. And not to say that I like VinCat being apart or with other people, cause I really dont, but I think it needed to happen. They needed something that big to test their love and boundaries and to experience other people so they could truly figure out their destiny. Its about them being able to chose that destiny despite everything that has happened and realizing that its still what they want and that the love they share is worth fighting for. And let me just say, it the "other people" VinCat chose were definitely not the right people to have tried to experience the other side of things, it was definitely executed very poorly, but I understand and get why it happened. When VinCat finally come back together they are stronger imo. Just like Cat said about everything they went through makes them stronger as a couple. If the manhunt for V happened in S1, the kidnapping, and Gabe hurting all those innocent people (the only 1 he was trying 2 hurt on S1 was just V) but S2, IT WAS Heather, JT, the reporter, Agent Knox, Cat if that happened in S1 ontop of V's self worth issues and confidence I think he wouldve bolted and really left Catherine. He never really felt like he deserved Catherine in S1. But by the time VinCat comes back together in S2, V feels worthy and confident of everything he has and deserves and it obvious on screen. And you can tell that nothing and no one will get in his way of his happily ever after with Cat and that he isnt going to be running anywhere. He wants Catherine and their life together and knows it might not be smooth sailing, but they deserve a future and wont back down because of an obstacle and that whatever gets in the way of them, they will overcome it and it will be VinCat in the end. And that is what I love so much about VinCat 3.0. I didnt feel like that in S1 when I refer to VinCat being unbreakable. I completely agree. Folks are so down on S2, sure its far from perfect, but I really enjoyed it. I think VinCat are in a very good place now to start off S3. |
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Post by jefferen on Sept 15, 2014 13:38:08 GMT -5
This is a reply to sunshine's post in Spoilers 301, but its a little off topic of 301 so I am posting it here I feel just the opposite about S1. Vincat 3.0 from 215 til 222 is my favorite. I think V self worth/ self esteem was a problem w/ VinCat 1.0. He lacked confidence too and it showed. I loved the swooning lines and the little moments between VinCat, but I kinda got annoyed after awhile with V always playing pity party and not having the confidence and self esteem to really believe that he deserved Catherine. Also IMO, I dont think that w/ the exception of Muirfield (which has always been a problem, even before VinCat got together) and Gabe, Vincat 1.0 imo, didn't have the opportunity to see how strong their relationship actually was or go through anything that major or big to know if they would survive and be able to withstand it. If it was Cat that got kidnapped at the end of S1 imo i dont think Vincent wouldve survived. I dont think he wouldve been able to hold on long enough to do what needed to be done to save Catherine, especially because in S1 he always felt so undeserving of Catherine. Vincent's kidnapping at the end of S1 changed everything. And when they finally did, in S2 after they find V and hes lost all his memories, and hes tetering on Man or Beast constantly because of his memory loss that slowly started to tear them apart. It didnt finally cultivate until Cat shot him. That was the arc that that truly tested them. Through the period of after Cat shot him, up until 211 when V finally realizes that he can trust Cat and he wants to be the man worthy enough of her love, VinCat is literally a mess. Because of the pull thats between VinCat/Jaystin (that even at odds is still smacking us in our face) I knew eventually that they would prevail, but I wasnt sure how long it was actually gonna take. And i loved watching VinCat work their way back to each other. Even when they were fighting, there were times I was waiting for their fights to break into passion. It was obvious to me at least, even if it wasnt to them yet, that regardless of what was going on between them that they were still our VinCat and underneath everything and still cared and loved each other despite everything. If what happened in S2 happened in S1 to VinCat I feel pretty confident to say that I dont think or believe that VinCat wouldve made it. And not to say that I like VinCat being apart or with other people, cause I really dont, but I think it needed to happen. They needed something that big to test their love and boundaries and to experience other people so they could truly figure out their destiny. Its about them being able to chose that destiny despite everything that has happened and realizing that its still what they want and that the love they share is worth fighting for. And let me just say, it the "other people" VinCat chose were definitely not the right people to have tried to experience the other side of things, it was definitely executed very poorly, but I understand and get why it happened. When VinCat finally come back together they are stronger imo. Just like Cat said about everything they went through makes them stronger as a couple. If the manhunt for V happened in S1, the kidnapping, and Gabe hurting all those innocent people (the only 1 he was trying 2 hurt on S1 was just V) but S2, IT WAS Heather, JT, the reporter, Agent Knox, Cat if that happened in S1 ontop of V's self worth issues and confidence I think he wouldve bolted and really left Catherine. He never really felt like he deserved Catherine in S1. But by the time VinCat comes back together in S2, V feels worthy and confident of everything he has and deserves and it obvious on screen. And you can tell that nothing and no one will get in his way of his happily ever after with Cat and that he isnt going to be running anywhere. He wants Catherine and their life together and knows it might not be smooth sailing, but they deserve a future and wont back down because of an obstacle and that whatever gets in the way of them, they will overcome it and it will be VinCat in the end. And that is what I love so much about VinCat 3.0. I didnt feel like that in S1 when I refer to VinCat being unbreakable. I completely agree. Folks are so down on S2, sure its far from perfect, but I really enjoyed it. I think VinCat are in a very good place now to start off S3. Agreed! To me comparing S1 to S2 is like comparing apples & oranges. They are so different. And there are some things that I wasnt crazy about story arc & execution wise in S1. Both seasons have things I loved and things that I wasnt so crazy about. My favorite arcs are 1x14-1x22 and 2x15-2x22 mostly because im a sucker for romance, chemistry & the undeniable pull that Jaystin have together and I love when VinCat are together but if it was all "sunshine & roses" for them the show might not necessarily be boring, but VinCat would never grow and it'd be like a stalemate and I personally wouldnt enjoy that. Not say that I could ever get enough of VinCat "alone time" but what kind of story would we really have if thats all it was? VinCat needed something that big to shake up their relationship. and the execution couldve been handled better, but VinCat needed 2 be apart to realize they are better together. Their break up was never about just advancing the plot per say and just making it a cause and affect of something. IMO their breakup had a purpose. I love VinCat together, and I will have a hard time if tptb just break them up so they have a story arc. The only type break up that I'd ever be okay w/ happening at least off the top of my head would be something more to the affect of Vincent or Cat breaking up w/ one another to either protect the other one from someone or something, or forces for one reason or another keeping them apart, but secretly they are pining away for each other. Otherwise for the most part, there might be some break ups I will excuse if there is a purpose and the story arc is executed correctly down the line, but to me VinCat is NOW a strong adult couple and have grown tremoudously since S1. Most of the time their intentions are good, they are honest w/ each other and arent afraid to speak their minds to each other, and most importantly they dont compromise themselves or what they believe in to hold on to one another. Yea, at times they disagree, but they eventually come together and are on the same wave length again. And that change doesnt happen because the other one is forcing that change, or guilting the other one. It happens because the character truly realizes its the correct and right thing. They are far different than so many other CW shows fated teenage, young couples and thats one of the other things and reasons I enjoy watching them. |
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and my gut is always telling me stuff too
