|
Post by Laura on Mar 9, 2014 13:36:16 GMT -5
Well, to live up to their "Who Am I" season long theme, Vincent has a better idea but I don't think Catherine has a clue. The writers have left a lot of work for her to accomplish in the remaining episodes. So, yeah, I could see some mouth dropping twist, maybe where Catherine goes completely off the rails in some unpleasant way, to provide the hook to the rest of the season. [Not speculating, just philosophizing] Catherine needs to plausibly rediscover her passion, her "basic instincts". I hear people when they say Vincent is the key, I'm just not sure how he unlocks the lock, so to speak. True that!
|
|
|
Post by eyeofthetiger on Mar 9, 2014 16:12:25 GMT -5
I've been thinking. I don't think she went to the boathouse for Gabe. I think she is totally trying to convince herself the this "im with Gabe" movement is worth giving up everything. I do not think that she wants to give up Vincent. I mean you don't stand that close to someone that you are trying to break up with. You go, you say your piece, and you leave. You don't linger with a gorgeous man in a robe w/ a frozen dinner. I don't think she knows how to be around Vincent without caring about & ultimately loving Vincent. How does one do that? It is nearly impossible when you think about how deep her connection with Vincent was in S1. So I think she went to the boathouse for herself, which is good in the sense that she is thinking more about herself than just Gabe. She is trying to do the right thing in that one part of her mind that seems to be immune to her heart & her other more important parts of her brain. She is still recovering from being so hurt, she is only running on her singly focused agenda to protect herself from being hurt again. When she was talking to Vincent it was like she was saying all the things she was trying to convince herself & him of. She was basically talking to herself as much as she was talking to him. I hope that her night will trigger something in her that will begin to penetrate the walls that she has refortified over the past season. Gabe is merely her mental sentry. He may think he is in, but he is not. I think her journey to finding her betterself began with the trip to the boathouse first in her dreams and then at the end of this episode. She will find herself by finding her way back to him, just like Vincent has found his way back to himself by finding his way back to her. The journey has begun to S3 who we are mission.
I like the theory of the literal chemistry between them being tied to the mystery. It does seem that Xavier was saved when she got involved.
|
|
|
Post by oriana happy 4 s3 on Mar 9, 2014 18:06:23 GMT -5
I was wondering what will save Catherine from the destructive path she is on and it occurred to me maybe there is literally chemistry between them. When she was in close proximity to Vincent in the wrecked car, she began to change. Then when she hugged him, it was more than just congratulations. (Gabe was right to be pissed) Then in the final scene she kept moving closer to him and her passion returned. So maybe that is a clue to how Vincent can break through her defenses. Get right in her face. Literally, "together we are stronger". This may tie in with Karin and Janeen's view that it was Catherine touching Vincent's shoulder that actually saved Xavier. She touched Vincent with her right hand, the one with Vanessa ring... It seems to me like Reynolds is the killer side and Vanessa is the saver side and both these sides are in Catherine toward Beasts and her love for V amplifies her salvific being! The power of love!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2014 18:23:48 GMT -5
I've been wondering about that last scene when Catherine moved closer to Vincent and touched his arm and said "I don't want to hurt you" ... Did she literally mean she didn't want to hurt him , physically or did she mean by being with Gabe ??
|
|
|
Post by Bill the beast on Mar 9, 2014 19:57:17 GMT -5
She touched Vincent with her right hand, the one with Vanessa ring... It seems to me like Reynolds is the killer side and Vanessa is the saver side and both these sides are in Catherine toward Beasts and her love for V amplifies her salvific being! The power of love! Very interesting! She is both Slayer and Saver? What's this about the "Vanessa Ring"? I missed that.
|
|
|
Post by eyeofthetiger on Mar 10, 2014 1:03:43 GMT -5
She touched Vincent with her right hand, the one with Vanessa ring... It seems to me like Reynolds is the killer side and Vanessa is the saver side and both these sides are in Catherine toward Beasts and her love for V amplifies her salvific being! The power of love! Very interesting! She is both Slayer and Saver? What's this about the "Vanessa Ring"? I missed that. I don’t even remember what thread we talked about it in. I will try to find it. But a few of us noticed that she has been wearing this ring since S1 that per KK (thru either interview or twitter) it is keepsake of her mothers. Well anyway, we discussed that this ring must have some significance to the story. We were thinking it might be connected to the mythology somehow. I had researched the original fairy tale and found out that there was a ring in the fairy tale that the beast gave beauty that she could twist and return to him. So I think that the ring definitely is somehow connected to the mythology, her mother, her connection w/ vincent etc. It has always seemed so prominent in scenes, but it has never been talked about in show. So we are speculating that this ring is special somehow. Maybe it is somehow related to that Gem. Another thing I noticed in regards to the ring is that it does not seem as prominent now in her scenes with Gabe. Maybe that is just over analyzing or it could be just directors/editors’ preference, but it could be significant of something. It’s obvious that someone either KK, Catherine Aston, or someone else finds it important to make sure that KK has the ring on in most scenes. So the attention to that detail to me is important and indicates that it may be important to the story as well. The wardrobe dept has always done a great job making sure the character’s are well reflected in the wardrobe choices. So it could just be that. But I so want it to be more, esp when we’re being teased w/ mythology & sci-fi....
|
|
|
Post by eyeofthetiger on Mar 10, 2014 1:42:04 GMT -5
Ironically we were talking about it in the spoiler/spec section under the Catch Me thread. The conversation about it really begins to take place around page 35. I answered Marz (from page 30 or 33)and then some other people commented & speculated on my response. If you wanna go back & look at some of it.
Feb 21, 2014 at 9:14pm Marz said: "I am trying so hard to stay positive - It is not working - the episodes seem to be getting dumber, if Catherine was my daughter - I would tell her to follow her heart and then kick her in the butt - - but I can see how mental and emotional abuse have made a mess of her - I'm just out of patience and understanding - ENOUGH ALREADY - realize you are with a master manipulator that is scary good at lying and probably secretly a beast - he has mastered control over it - time to find out what happened to Rebecca Reynolds and how she handled her beast - Mama Chandler still has a part to play - and what is with the ring on her index finger??"
Here is what my original post said. Post by eyeofthetiger on Feb 22, 2014 at 8:49am
"I think the ring that Catherine always wears has some symbolic meaning (maybe even power) that will be revealed in future episodes (hopefully 15 or 16). I believe the ring may have belonged to Vanessa and it will be crucial in the mythology as a source of goodness & love. The ring just always seemed so prominent in many of the Vincat pictures in S1, not as much in S2 as we lost Vincat. I don't think it just coincidence that she always wears this ring, esp around Vincent. IMO, the writers/producers/directors have slowly woven a bit mythology from the original fairy tale without loudly bringing it to our attention. I have noticed the ring for ages, but never assumed it could be part of the mythology until the writers kept on harping on bring the mythology this season. I always thought it was a heirloom from her mother that she wore to keep her memory close. But as you said, Mama Chandler still does have a part to play - and I think the ring is going to be part of her role in the story. Ultimately, I believe that the ring will lead Catherine back to Vincent and help her choose him. I can't remember all the Gaberine scenes, but I do not believe that we see the ring as much when they are together as we saw when Vincat was together. I also think the ring will play a part in the mythology because it comes from the original fairy tale.
In the original fairy tale, probably as well as many of the adaptations, after spending months with the Beast after sacrificing her freedom to save her father (the merchant) from captivity, the beast lets her go out of love to visit her home for 1 week because she is homesick. He gives her 2 presents, an enchanted mirror & a ring. The mirror allows her to see what is going on back at the Beast's castle. The ring allows her to return to him & the castle instantly if she twists it 3 times. When she returns, her evil sisters out of jealousy trick her to staying longer than a week by pretending to truly miss and love her. Belle convinced by their lies stays longer then a week. She begins to feel guilty for abandoning the Beast and uses the mirror to see him. She sees that he is dying by the rose bush that her father had taken the rose from. She immediately twists the ring 3 times and returns to him. When she sees him she begins to cry and says that she loves him. As her tears touch him he is transformed back into a human by the tears and her declaration. He explains to her that a fairy changed him into a beast years ago after he refused to let her seek shelter in his castle during a rain storm. The fairy stated that the only thing that would break the curse was if he could find true love despite his inner ugliness. In another version of the fairy tale, Belle was the daughter of a king and good fairy, the wicked fairy tried to kill her so she could marry the king. To protect her, she was disguised and raised as a merchant's daughter. In this tale, the prince of another local kingdom was left in the care of the wicked fairy by his mother. When he became an adult the wicked fairy tried to seduce him and he refused. So the wicked fairy cursed him and changed him into a beast. The rest of the story follows the general plot line of Belle rescuing Beast from his curse.
So I believe the writers are using elements from the original and the alternative version of the fairy tale. I think that we will find out that Catherine being the daughter of Vanessa and Reynolds will be critical to her role in helping save Vincent. That somehow Vanessa's bloodline is special and will be part of why she can save Vincent, it is from the good fairies. I think that perhaps the Reynolds bloodline represents the wicked fairies and that is why Rebecca was hunting the beasts.Mama Chandler knew her daughter was at risk, so she married Mr. Chandler to protect her. Mr. Chandler was not aware of how much danger Catherine was in, but eventually found something out which is why he was killed. I do not believe the BATB writers will or could introduce fairies into the story, but I think they will simplify the concepts into good v. evil. The fairy tale provides the mythical concepts, but I think they intend on using more scientific elements such as genes & serums to explain how the concepts work in a modern setting. I think the jewel necklace is kinda hybrid of the scientific and the mythological. The ring will likely be the same way. How else do you explain mythological fairies in a modern world? The show does not have the artistic license to blend realistic settings w/ fairytale elements, like true blood and other shows have. The BATB writers have firmly placed BATB in the realistic present day NYC, so unless they plan on changing the setting of the show, we have to assume that they do not intend to introduce fairy tale elements, but rather disguise them in science and mythology. Being both the daughter of good and evil, she is has the unique role of being able to save or destroy the beasts. But in the end, Catherine will likely be more influenced by Vanessa's good bloodline. What I can't understand though is now that there is possibilities of multiple beasts what does that mean for Catherine? And what makes Vincent so special from the other beasts? I'm trying to figure out that backstory parallel to the fairytales. It made sense when there was only 1 beast, but now that there are more it becomes trickier to understand how the mythology plays out.
Not sure if this belongs in this section or the general spoilers/speculations. But I thought that I would place it here to answer your question about the ring."
|
|
|
Post by Bill the beast on Mar 10, 2014 10:19:52 GMT -5
I don't want to dampen that kind of theorizing because, believe me, I like your ideas much better than what I'm about to say. In fact as I read your post, I thought Now we're getting somewhere. However, as a KK fan, it has long been clear to me that she loves exotic rings. I could show examples from the Lana-Days but here is one from a Press Junket on 18 July 2013, I think. Attachments:
|
|
|
Post by chilly20 on Mar 10, 2014 10:57:07 GMT -5
I've been wondering about that last scene when Catherine moved closer to Vincent and touched his arm and said "I don't want to hurt you" ... Did she literally mean she didn't want to hurt him , physically or did she mean by being with Gabe ?? I think she was referring to what her father had said to her. That she should kill all beasts, especially Vincent. Then she had her nightmare, so she thinks she is going to hurt him, or so she did at that time.
|
|
|
Post by Bill the beast on Mar 10, 2014 11:21:33 GMT -5
Just as more fuel to the ring-fire, I went back and took a look at "Ancestors". Sidebar: it was interesting how Tori's effect on Vincent paralleled the current Gabe's effect on Cat. Tori was clouding Vincent's mind, constantly jealous and paranoid about Catherine. Karin & Janeen (Forever Beasties) theorized that Cat is genetically super-sensitive to "Beast Essence" and that Gabe still retains some of that and is clouding her mind. What is truly in his heart is reflected in her confused behavior. Anyway, back to rings, in that episode the thief Mara was to signal the gang by "twirling" her ring. This was not Cat's ring but came from the dead Mara. It looks like a simple band of diamonds and is on KK's left forefinger (assuming these are KK's hands and that the image hasn't been reversed). There are no other rings on her hands at this moment. (Twisting the ring 3 times was in your version of the fairy tale) Attachments:
|
|
nosleep3
Rookie Cop
You'll forget the sun in his jealous sky, when we walk in fields of gold.
Posts: 54
|
Post by nosleep3 on Mar 10, 2014 14:25:41 GMT -5
I think my issue with this episode is that Catherine is being wishy-washy rather than strong. First she allows her boyfriend to forbid her from seeing Vincent outside of their current Beast-related objective, then she allows Gabe to forbid her from seeing Vincent at all, then she goes to Vincent's place to tell him that she's going to comply with Gabe, then she falls into Vincent's arms on impulse.
This sounds like a woman who does not know what she wants, so she just does whatever. And not everyone has their crap together all the time, so I can't fault her for not being perfect. But it's such an about face from the woman she was at the beginning of the season. I wasn't too happy with the show at that time, but at least Cat could stick to a decision.
If she wants to be with Gabe or Vincent or neither of them, whatever she chooses is fine. But she needs to make up her OWN mind, not wait around for the men to make her mind up for her.
|
|
|
Post by Bill the beast on Mar 10, 2014 17:41:15 GMT -5
This sounds like a woman who does not know what she wants ... Fair enough. Our lovely Catherine has been reduced to this. It is what it is. See my Sidebar in my post above.
|
|