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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Dec 11, 2014 6:54:56 GMT -5
That must have been an interesting read indeed! I think you have a good point. They should give the fans what they want, at least once. Now maybe the day we get that, will be the day the series end, so maybe, I'm not so impatient after all ;-) The more we wait and expect, the crazier and more passionate we become! i agree plus i do think it woudl be boring if we got too much romance. what i want is quality, non rushed romance, deep quiet moments even if they last very little  and they dont need to be happy ones either, i like angst - as long as they are real, deep, passionate i am happy |
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Post by tenshi on Dec 11, 2014 7:40:19 GMT -5
Hey alwaycrazedbatbfan (are we allowed to shorten your pseudo name, it took me some time here, LOL) Just kidding of course You are right, I know Cat is like that and it was perfectly understandable to see her that way, and I get the message they sent us.... Now, I'm really wondering when they will have time! I mean we know there'll always be beast issues and villains to cope with and people to defend, and we need that, so do you really think we'll have a whole 10-20 minutes of an episode in season 3 with them just enjoying themselves?! Really! I'm not sure about that... 10-20 mins?  lol impossible! maybe we get 5 if we are lucky. i am being serious here... it would be amazing if they gave us that but i doubt it. season 3 will be very fast paced so if they manage to give us some deep/quiet moments of 5 mins each then i will be satisfied i think I want a love scene (just one in the hole season would be enough!) like AMP or Insatiable! Basta!    |
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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Dec 11, 2014 7:48:45 GMT -5
10-20 mins? lol impossible! maybe we get 5 if we are lucky. i am being serious here... it would be amazing if they gave us that but i doubt it. season 3 will be very fast paced so if they manage to give us some deep/quiet moments of 5 mins each then i will be satisfied i think I want a love scene (just one in the hole season would be enough!) like AMP or Insatiable! Basta! omg i soooo want a love scene! badly! but i doubt we will get it... |
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Post by tenshi on Dec 11, 2014 8:13:18 GMT -5
I want a love scene (just one in the hole season would be enough!) like AMP or Insatiable! Basta! omg i soooo want a love scene! badly! but i doubt we will get it... Don't doubt! HOPE HOPE HOPE! Otherwise it'll be a self-fulfilling prophecy!  |
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Post by alwayscrazedbatbfan on Dec 11, 2014 17:39:22 GMT -5
If the network/writers/showrunners etc. paid ANY attention to the comments and feedback from THIS episode alone, they would know that, across the board, fans didn't like the episode overall because they EXPECTED to see a VinCat love scene. I mean, it is the first time VinCat have had a chance to supposedly relax and accept downtime (even if they would rather be working to exonerate Vincent themselves). For the first time, they are actually living together AND supposed to be portraying a husband and wife. You just EXPECTED some commentary from them about where they were going in the relationship, whether or not they liked pretending to be husband and wife, how their lives would be different if suburbia actually became an option for them, etc. And we certainly DID expect to see passion between the two (particularly given the scenes from 216 and 217 and all the interruptions that had followed). This lull in the storm was expected to be passion-oriented and give VinCat something to shoot for in their lives once they left suburbia. That is not what happened on the screen. I mean, "Ever After" almost seems to be a sarcastic title to the episode, given what happens onscreen. Almost all of the comments I have read reveal an audience that felt they were deprived of what appeared to be a romance-oriented episode.
(Don't get me wrong--I still LOVE the portrayal of Vincent's unwavering acceptance of Cat and her needs in 220 AND Vincent's willingness to compromise in the future and put himself at risk in order to acquire the type of life that Cat wants as well as him. My inner feminist goddess approved, especially since Vincent had been so ready to put his needs over Cat's during the first of the season. Again, Vincent still gets a partial pass for his early attitude due to what all had happened to him. Vincent was basically incapable of fully reaching his humanity, and it took time and Cat to help him get back to the person we all know and love.)
But if this episode SHOULD have shown the Powers That Be anything, it is that the audience WANTS romantic moments between VinCat. And although you got a few cute moments in this episode, you didn't see ANY expected romance between VinCat. So MY HOPE is that the Powers That Be learned from this AND will give us those romantic moments in Season 3.
And YES, Anapi, Corinne, and Tenshi, I would EXPECT to get an AMP-type love scene at some point. I mean, they are supposedly getting ENGAGED and MARRIED, and apparently Cat's mother's ring is going to bring still yet more baddies after them. So SHOULD make VinCat that much more aware of how easily they could still lose each other. So LET US SEE how much they need one another AND are willing to face death itself in order to be together.
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Post by lovebatb on Dec 11, 2014 17:51:08 GMT -5
I always saw the title as a sarcastic title!
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Post by tenshi on Dec 11, 2014 17:59:36 GMT -5
If the network/writers/showrunners etc. paid ANY attention to the comments and feedback from THIS episode alone, they would know that, across the board, fans didn't like the episode overall because they EXPECTED to see a VinCat love scene. I mean, it is the first time VinCat have had a chance to supposedly relax and accept downtime (even if they would rather be working to exonerate Vincent themselves). For the first time, they are actually living together AND supposed to be portraying a husband and wife. You just EXPECTED some commentary from them about where they were going in the relationship, whether or not they liked pretending to be husband and wife, how their lives would be different if suburbia actually became an option for them, etc. And we certainly DID expect to see passion between the two (particularly given the scenes from 216 and 217 and all the interruptions that had followed). This lull in the storm was expected to be passion-oriented and give VinCat something to shoot for in their lives once they left suburbia. That is not what happened on the screen. I mean, "Ever After" almost seems to be a sarcastic title to the episode, given what happens onscreen. Almost all of the comments I have read reveal an audience that felt they were deprived of what appeared to be a romance-oriented episode. (Don't get me wrong--I still LOVE the portrayal of Vincent's unwavering acceptance of Cat and her needs in 220 AND Vincent's willingness to compromise in the future and put himself at risk in order to acquire the type of life that Cat wants as well as him. My inner feminist goddess approved, especially since Vincent had been so ready to put his needs over Cat's during the first of the season. Again, Vincent still gets a partial pass for his early attitude due to what all had happened to him. Vincent was basically incapable of fully reaching his humanity, and it took time and Cat to help him get back to the person we all know and love.) But if this episode SHOULD have shown the Powers That Be anything, it is that the audience WANTS romantic moments between VinCat. And although you got a few cute moments in this episode, you didn't see ANY expected romance between VinCat. So MY HOPE is that the Powers That Be learned from this AND will give us those romantic moments in Season 3. And YES, Anapi, Corinne, and Tenshi, I would EXPECT to get an AMP-type love scene at some point. I mean, they are supposedly getting ENGAGED and MARRIED, and apparently Cat's mother's ring is going to bring still yet more baddies after them. So SHOULD make VinCat that much more aware of how easily they could still lose each other. So LET US SEE how much they need one another AND are willing to face death itself in order to be together. PLEASE write this to the network, the show runners and writers! |
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Post by alwayscrazedbatbfan on Dec 12, 2014 1:29:28 GMT -5
To Lovebatb:
Yes, I totally agree that "Ever After" was always meant to basically be a sarcastic title. I didn't explain what I really meant in my post about this. I thought the writers were going for Sarcastic-Funny HaHa with the title. I mean, Catherine is initially watching the songbird sing, just like a Disney princess. (AND I also thought that was a mini little nod to KK's earlier role of having played Snow White.) However, Catherine rapidly finds that she has NO desire whatsoever to be the traditional old-school princess, locked away in a tower from everyone BUT the guy and expected to be happy with no other life than being rescued by Prince Charming. That is not her version of "happily ever after." Hence why she throws the newspaper at the singing songbird after her first night in quiet suburbia.
What I meant by my earlier comment was that the title almost seems Sarcastic-Mean to me in that it took absolutely no time whatsoever (not even a day) for a life together between VinCat to fall apart. I mean, Catherine doesn't even seem to try to like suburbia and living with Vincent. She can't even look at it as a welcome vacation away. I mean, I get why they wrote it the way they did due to time constraints. You couldn't have Vincent and Catherine enjoying suburbia, putting together each room together and quarrelling over one another's tastes, and have enough time to have an actual plot (and B-story regarding Gabe and the body of the witness). However, it makes Catherine look downright cold to many viewers in that she clearly wants out of suburbia so badly and so quickly, even knowing that this time is a respite for Vincent, who has been on the run and having to sleep who knows where at night due to the manhunt, PARTICULARLY when he has stayed in NY and continued to live on the run in order to remain in contact with Cat.
So I think the writers were going more for humor AND to show that Vincent truly loves Cat NOT just because she is a Beauty outside but because she wants justice for all and to save others. LOVED that quality about the episode.
(Still, personally, the overall effect of the episode for many, myself included at least during the first watch, was disappointment. I wanted to see Catherine actually WANT the fairy tale, at least in part. I wanted to see them decorate together and talk about what their first place together would look like. What they would want for themselves if they got a chance to do Normal. Because 217 AND 218 contained repeated discussions between VinCat that they were fighting for Normal Together. I wanted discussions between them as to what their "normal" would look like for them. At least HEAR THEM TALKING ABOUT christening the rooms, maybe Vincent planning a mini picnic for them in a second-floor room since they can't utilize the roof.)
I wanted to see Cat actually have a few regrets about coming back to the real world, even though she knows that suburbia isn't right for them at that time. Because she enjoyed her time with Vincent, even under the circumstances. Think AMP and "Insatiable" from Season 1--I mean, Cat was in the impossible position of having to be on the Task Force hunting Vincent that is closing in on him, the noose is tightening, there seems no way out YET the two are so happy with their little moment in bed of being able to wake up together, at least for THAT moment. I just wanted one type of scene like that, where the two are just so lost in one another that the whole world simply falls away. To be deprived of that and yet name the episode "Ever After" just seemed to be Sarcastic-Cruel rather than Sarcastic-Funny/comical.
That is the one redeeming factor that gets left over from this episode: before "Ever After," Vincent and Catherine weren't even considering living together. Catherine obviously DID appreciate this aspect from "Ever After" in that she never lives apart from Vincent thereafter for what was left of the season. She lived right alongside Vincent in the hostel in NY rather than returning to her apartment. So she clearly DID have that Ah-Ha! moment of sorts in 220, as did Vincent. Because when they finally leave the hostel, Vincent clearly goes with Cat to her apartment rather than the boathouse. And we see in 222 that Vincent still enjoys getting up and making breakfast for THEM, as he wanted to do in 220. So after having briefly lived together in suburbia, VinCat clearly DON'T want to be apart thereafter. So whatever little moments of pleasure and satisfaction that they did have in 220 led to their decision to live together moving forwards, even before Vincent gets exonerated.
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Post by tenshi on Dec 12, 2014 5:12:36 GMT -5
To Lovebatb: Yes, I totally agree that "Ever After" was always meant to basically be a sarcastic title. I didn't explain what I really meant in my post about this. I thought the writers were going for Sarcastic-Funny HaHa with the title. I mean, Catherine is initially watching the songbird sing, just like a Disney princess. (AND I also thought that was a mini little nod to KK's earlier role of having played Snow White.) However, Catherine rapidly finds that she has NO desire whatsoever to be the traditional old-school princess, locked away in a tower from everyone BUT the guy and expected to be happy with no other life than being rescued by Prince Charming. That is not her version of "happily ever after." Hence why she throws the newspaper at the singing songbird after her first night in quiet suburbia. What I meant by my earlier comment was that the title almost seems Sarcastic-Mean to me in that it took absolutely no time whatsoever (not even a day) for a life together between VinCat to fall apart. I mean, Catherine doesn't even seem to try to like suburbia and living with Vincent. She can't even look at it as a welcome vacation away. I mean, I get why they wrote it the way they did due to time constraints. You couldn't have Vincent and Catherine enjoying suburbia, putting together each room together and quarrelling over one another's tastes, and have enough time to have an actual plot (and B-story regarding Gabe and the body of the witness). However, it makes Catherine look downright cold to many viewers in that she clearly wants out of suburbia so badly and so quickly, even knowing that this time is a respite for Vincent, who has been on the run and having to sleep who knows where at night due to the manhunt, PARTICULARLY when he has stayed in NY and continued to live on the run in order to remain in contact with Cat. So I think the writers were going more for humor AND to show that Vincent truly loves Cat NOT just because she is a Beauty outside but because she wants justice for all and to save others. LOVED that quality about the episode. (Still, personally, the overall effect of the episode for many, myself included at least during the first watch, was disappointment. I wanted to see Catherine actually WANT the fairy tale, at least in part. I wanted to see them decorate together and talk about what their first place together would look like. What they would want for themselves if they got a chance to do Normal. Because 217 AND 218 contained repeated discussions between VinCat that they were fighting for Normal Together. I wanted discussions between them as to what their "normal" would look like for them. At least HEAR THEM TALKING ABOUT christening the rooms, maybe Vincent planning a mini picnic for them in a second-floor room since they can't utilize the roof.) I wanted to see Cat actually have a few regrets about coming back to the real world, even though she knows that suburbia isn't right for them at that time. Because she enjoyed her time with Vincent, even under the circumstances. Think AMP and "Insatiable" from Season 1--I mean, Cat was in the impossible position of having to be on the Task Force hunting Vincent that is closing in on him, the noose is tightening, there seems no way out YET the two are so happy with their little moment in bed of being able to wake up together, at least for THAT moment. I just wanted one type of scene like that, where the two are just so lost in one another that the whole world simply falls away. To be deprived of that and yet name the episode "Ever After" just seemed to be Sarcastic-Cruel rather than Sarcastic-Funny/comical. That is the one redeeming factor that gets left over from this episode: before "Ever After," Vincent and Catherine weren't even considering living together. Catherine obviously DID appreciate this aspect from "Ever After" in that she never lives apart from Vincent thereafter for what was left of the season. She lived right alongside Vincent in the hostel in NY rather than returning to her apartment. So she clearly DID have that Ah-Ha! moment of sorts in 220, as did Vincent. Because when they finally leave the hostel, Vincent clearly goes with Cat to her apartment rather than the boathouse. And we see in 222 that Vincent still enjoys getting up and making breakfast for THEM, as he wanted to do in 220. So after having briefly lived together in suburbia, VinCat clearly DON'T want to be apart thereafter. So whatever little moments of pleasure and satisfaction that they did have in 220 led to their decision to live together moving forwards, even before Vincent gets exonerated. They could have included a scene like that, just in shortening some other scenes - which had been possible without any harm to the plot - and in addition there were scenes which were absolutly redundant like the one Gabe meeting the guy which spotted Vincent. IMO! |
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Post by alwayscrazedbatbfan on Dec 12, 2014 5:20:42 GMT -5
Tenshi,
I agree totally with your above post. I mean, look at episode 217. It was FAR more action-packed and needed far more to happen to forward its plot, yet they still had the time to put in the incredibly sweet and romantic scenes in the prison and at Cat's apartment (not just the bathroom scene but the gem comment/handcuffs scene). So I do think that 220 really was a wasted opportunity to show a loving VinCat moment.
My only comfort remains that the audience was supposed to "imply" that VinCat DID have some happy romance time together in seeing Vincent carry Cat over the threshold into the house, and he did not emerge thereafter to unpack the car until a full day later. And Vincent clearly sleeps WELL both nights (due to the unseen activities), which is why he bounds down the steps so happily looking for Cat. So I get that the happy VinCat moments took place, I just would have liked to have SEEN more or at least had sweet commentary or looks between the two regarding said activities. Sigh.
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Post by tenshi on Dec 12, 2014 5:32:18 GMT -5
Tenshi, I agree totally with your above post. I mean, look at episode 217. It was FAR more action-packed and needed far more to happen to forward its plot, yet they still had the time to put in the incredibly sweet and romantic scenes in the prison and at Cat's apartment (not just the bathroom scene but the gem comment/handcuffs scene). So I do think that 220 really was a wasted opportunity to show a loving VinCat moment. My only comfort remains that the audience was supposed to "imply" that VinCat DID have some happy romance time together in seeing Vincent carry Cat over the threshold into the house, and he did not emerge thereafter to unpack the car until a full day later. And Vincent clearly sleeps WELL both nights (due to the unseen activities), which is why he bounds down the steps so happily looking for Cat. So I get that the happy VinCat moments took place, I just would have liked to have SEEN more or at least had sweet commentary or looks between the two regarding said activities. Sigh. Yeah! I hope they learned from the comments they got on twitter after the episode and do better in S3! |
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Post by lovebatb on Dec 12, 2014 5:52:54 GMT -5
To Lovebatb: Yes, I totally agree that "Ever After" was always meant to basically be a sarcastic title. I didn't explain what I really meant in my post about this. I thought the writers were going for Sarcastic-Funny HaHa with the title. I mean, Catherine is initially watching the songbird sing, just like a Disney princess. (AND I also thought that was a mini little nod to KK's earlier role of having played Snow White.) However, Catherine rapidly finds that she has NO desire whatsoever to be the traditional old-school princess, locked away in a tower from everyone BUT the guy and expected to be happy with no other life than being rescued by Prince Charming. That is not her version of "happily ever after." Hence why she throws the newspaper at the singing songbird after her first night in quiet suburbia. What I meant by my earlier comment was that the title almost seems Sarcastic-Mean to me in that it took absolutely no time whatsoever (not even a day) for a life together between VinCat to fall apart. I mean, Catherine doesn't even seem to try to like suburbia and living with Vincent. She can't even look at it as a welcome vacation away. I mean, I get why they wrote it the way they did due to time constraints. You couldn't have Vincent and Catherine enjoying suburbia, putting together each room together and quarrelling over one another's tastes, and have enough time to have an actual plot (and B-story regarding Gabe and the body of the witness). However, it makes Catherine look downright cold to many viewers in that she clearly wants out of suburbia so badly and so quickly, even knowing that this time is a respite for Vincent, who has been on the run and having to sleep who knows where at night due to the manhunt, PARTICULARLY when he has stayed in NY and continued to live on the run in order to remain in contact with Cat. So I think the writers were going more for humor AND to show that Vincent truly loves Cat NOT just because she is a Beauty outside but because she wants justice for all and to save others. LOVED that quality about the episode. (Still, personally, the overall effect of the episode for many, myself included at least during the first watch, was disappointment. I wanted to see Catherine actually WANT the fairy tale, at least in part. I wanted to see them decorate together and talk about what their first place together would look like. What they would want for themselves if they got a chance to do Normal. Because 217 AND 218 contained repeated discussions between VinCat that they were fighting for Normal Together. I wanted discussions between them as to what their "normal" would look like for them. At least HEAR THEM TALKING ABOUT christening the rooms, maybe Vincent planning a mini picnic for them in a second-floor room since they can't utilize the roof.) I wanted to see Cat actually have a few regrets about coming back to the real world, even though she knows that suburbia isn't right for them at that time. Because she enjoyed her time with Vincent, even under the circumstances. Think AMP and "Insatiable" from Season 1--I mean, Cat was in the impossible position of having to be on the Task Force hunting Vincent that is closing in on him, the noose is tightening, there seems no way out YET the two are so happy with their little moment in bed of being able to wake up together, at least for THAT moment. I just wanted one type of scene like that, where the two are just so lost in one another that the whole world simply falls away. To be deprived of that and yet name the episode "Ever After" just seemed to be Sarcastic-Cruel rather than Sarcastic-Funny/comical. That is the one redeeming factor that gets left over from this episode: before "Ever After," Vincent and Catherine weren't even considering living together. Catherine obviously DID appreciate this aspect from "Ever After" in that she never lives apart from Vincent thereafter for what was left of the season. She lived right alongside Vincent in the hostel in NY rather than returning to her apartment. So she clearly DID have that Ah-Ha! moment of sorts in 220, as did Vincent. Because when they finally leave the hostel, Vincent clearly goes with Cat to her apartment rather than the boathouse. And we see in 222 that Vincent still enjoys getting up and making breakfast for THEM, as he wanted to do in 220. So after having briefly lived together in suburbia, VinCat clearly DON'T want to be apart thereafter. So whatever little moments of pleasure and satisfaction that they did have in 220 led to their decision to live together moving forwards, even before Vincent gets exonerated. I really see your point. But, let's be honest: if they have given us just one moment of romance between Vincat it would have changed the whole disappointment thing and the impression of selfish and reckless behavior of Catherine! |
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and they dont need to be happy ones either, i like angst - as long as they are real, deep, passionate i am happy
