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Post by ArwenFan on Apr 12, 2013 21:49:16 GMT -5
Okay, I’m bored so I decided to do something. I don’t know how many of you followed Smallville, but Kristen Kreuk has had her share of damn good-looking leading men. I loved her and Tom Welling as Clark and Lana, but as much as I loved that pairing, I have to admit that relationship was written poorly and just begs a comparison with Kristen’s new series and of course, Vincent and Catherine. So…without further blah, blah, blah from me; here we go! For those who don’t know, Smallville was all about teen-aged Clark Kent’s life and relationships before he became Superman. One of Clark’s biggest passions was Lana Lang. Lana already had a boyfriend when the series started, but she and Clark became friends and soon had the longest unresolved, dissatisfying relationship on television. This was because Clark had to guard his secret abilities from everyone and this kept him and Lana apart because she knew he was hiding something from her. Clark believed that he was protecting Lana by not telling her the truth about himself. So fans had to endure lots of longing gazes and unresolved sexual tension, and when I say long I’m talking 5 friggin’ seasons worth. Of course, there was the obligatory “love triangles.” Although The Vampire Diaries has put a permanent bad taste in my mouth for this particular trope, Smallville got the ball rolling. Now the mere mention of a “love triangle” has the power to send me running from my television set, screaming at the top of my lungs while trying to claw my eyes out.  But I digress. Clark and Lana did try to become an official couple at one point during the unbearable five, but something happened and Clark had to start lying and pushing Lana away. They finally had a short reprieve and became lovers, then all hell broke loose and they were wrenched apart again until season seven. By this time the relationship was so jaded and broken that it was apparent to almost everyone that it was never going to work—not to mention they had to bring in Lois Lane, Clark’s one true and forever love.  In the beginning, Clark and Lana were sweet and anticipation for them getting together was high, but the writers totally ruined the relationship and kept Clark’s secret from Lana well past its shelf life. It’s hard to believe that Kelly Sounders and Brian Peterson (part of the Smallville brain trust) are now working on Beauty and the Beast, which has thrown down the gauntlet and refused to play a bunch of juvenile games with its power couple. The weaknesses heaped on Clark and Lana are largely missing from Vincent and Catherine. 1. C/L were kids, so there was angst on top of angst in their relationship. There was angst for angst’s sake for crying out loud. Clark told endless lies and Lana cried endless tears. V/C are adults and have tackled every issue between them head-on despite the occasional discomfort total honesty caused. 2. Clark slept with Lana without telling her about his alien nature; when he got his powers back, he concocted a mind-boggling number of ridiculous reasons to keep from being intimate with her. Vincent expressed his intimacy fears to Catherine. He respected her enough to be honest, let her come to terms with what he’d told her and let her decide for herself if she wanted to move forward. 3. Clark was always in the middle of a situation and because he was a one-man first responder; he let Lana down a lot, then covered with a bunch of see-through lies. Vincent unofficially works with Catherine; they share information and they rarely leave the other swinging in the wind without explanation. 4. Clark and Lana fought against their attraction because there was Chloe, Whitney and, later, Lex. Vincent tried to push Catherine away despite his attraction to her, but she made him feel like he could have a shot at life again, so he sucked it up and followed his heart. As for Cat, she is nothing if not tenacious. Catherine would not allow Vincent or JT to chase her away. She didn’t get sidetracked by Evan or firefighters. She proved more than a match for Alex Salter and debunked all of Vincent’s insecurities. In short, he was putty in her hands. 5. Catherine and Vincent have a healthy connection; only she can calm the beast raging within him and he keeps her steady and focused when relationship stresses and keeping secrets causes her to become flustered. Fearing the worst, Clark never let Lana or anyone close enough to help shoulder his burdens or ease his loneliness. And fans, well, mainly haters started calling the relationship dysfunctional and abusive. 6. Lana was mostly a damsel in distress whereas Catherine is a New York police detective and is more than able to take care of herself. 7. Lana never called Clark on his B.S. Catherine doesn’t let Vincent get away with any of his and vice versa. 8. Vincent and Catherine are willing and determined to fight for their love. Clark and Lana were never on the same page at the same time. 9. Clark (Tom Welling) is tall with near perfect features (luscious lips, anyone?), but while Vincent (Jay Ryan) is not classically handsome, he trumps CK/TW with his husky voice, raw sex appeal and killer abs—not to mention the rest of that body. 10. KK and TW had good chemistry and made Clark and Lana believable, but KK and JR have insane chemistry, so VinCat sizzles. 11. So far the drama in Vincent and Catherine’s relationship comes from the outside, Clark and Lana’s drama was always internal, i.e. caused by the two of them. 12. Vincent and Cat work well together, see AMP or PIC for confirmation. Clark worked well with Chloe (because she stumbled across his secret), but he and Lana never really had the chance. So sad. 13. Smallville had killer music. Beauty and the Beast has stepped up since the early episodes, but they still have a way to go before I have burned my own BATB mix. Well, that’s my list. Comments? Additions? |
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Darcy
Detective
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Post by Darcy on Apr 12, 2013 21:57:52 GMT -5
Okay, I’m bored so I decided to do something. I don’t know how many of you followed Smallville, but Kristen Kreuk has had her share of damn good-looking leading men. I loved her and Tom Welling as Clark and Lana, but as much as I loved that pairing, I have to admit that relationship was written poorly and just begs a comparison with Kristen’s new series and of course, Vincent and Catherine. So…without further blah, blah, blah from me; here we go! For those who don’t know, Smallville was all about teen-aged Clark Kent’s life and relationships before he became Superman. One of Clark’s biggest passions was Lana Lang. Lana already had a boyfriend when the series started, but she and Clark became friends and soon had the longest unresolved, dissatisfying relationship on television. This was because Clark had to guard his secret abilities from everyone and this kept him and Lana apart because she knew he was hiding something from her. Clark believed that he was protecting Lana by not telling her the truth about himself. So fans had to endure lots of longing gazes and unresolved sexual tension, and when I say long I’m talking 5 friggin’ seasons worth. Of course, there was the obligatory “love triangles.” Although The Vampire Diaries has put a permanent bad taste in my mouth for this particular trope, Smallville got the ball rolling. Now the mere mention of a “love triangle” has the power to send me running from my television set, screaming at the top of my lungs while trying to claw my eyes out. But I digress. Clark and Lana did try to become an official couple at one point during the unbearable five, but something happened and Clark had to start lying and pushing Lana away. They finally had a short reprieve and became lovers, then all hell broke loose and they were wrenched apart again until season seven. By this time the relationship was so jaded and broken that it was apparent to almost everyone that it was never going to work—not to mention they had to bring in Lois Lane, Clark’s one true and forever love. In the beginning, Clark and Lana were sweet and anticipation for them getting together was high, but the writers totally ruined the relationship and kept Clark’s secret from Lana well past its shelf life. It’s hard to believe that Kelly Sounders and Brian Peterson (part of the Smallville brain trust) are now working on Beauty and the Beast, which has thrown down the gauntlet and refused to play a bunch of juvenile games with its power couple. The weaknesses heaped on Clark and Lana are largely missing from Vincent and Catherine. 1. C/L were kids, so there was angst on top of angst in their relationship. There was angst for angst’s sake for crying out loud. Clark told endless lies and Lana cried endless tears. V/C are adults and have tackled every issue between them head-on despite the occasional discomfort total honesty caused. 2. Clark slept with Lana without telling her about his alien nature; when he got his powers back, he concocted a mind-boggling number of ridiculous reasons to keep from being intimate with her. Vincent expressed his intimacy fears to Catherine. He respected her enough to be honest, let her come to terms with what he’d told her and let her decide for herself if she wanted to move forward. 3. Clark was always in the middle of a situation and because he was a one-man first responder; he let Lana down a lot, then covered with a bunch of see-through lies. Vincent unofficially works with Catherine; they share information and they rarely leave the other swinging in the wind without explanation. 4. Clark and Lana fought against their attraction because there was Chloe, Whitney and, later, Lex. Vincent tried to push Catherine away despite his attraction to her, but she made him feel like he could have a shot at life again, so he sucked it up and followed his heart. As for Cat, she is nothing if not tenacious. Catherine would not allow Vincent or JT to chase her away. She didn’t get sidetracked by Evan or firefighters. She proved more than a match for Alex Salter and debunked all of Vincent’s insecurities. In short, he was putty in her hands. 5. Catherine and Vincent have a healthy connection; only she can calm the beast raging within him and he keeps her steady and focused when relationship stresses and keeping secrets causes her to become flustered. Fearing the worst, Clark never let Lana or anyone close enough to help shoulder his burdens or ease his loneliness. 6. Lana was mostly a damsel in distress whereas Catherine is a New York police detective and is more than able to take care of herself. 7. Lana never called Clark on his B.S. Catherine doesn’t let Vincent get away with any of his and vice versa. 8. Vincent and Catherine are willing and determined to fight for their love. Clark and Lana were never on the same page at the same time. 9. Clark (Tom Welling) is tall with near perfect features (luscious lips, anyone?), but while Vincent (Jay Ryan) is not classically handsome, he trumps CK/TW with his husky voice, raw sex appeal and killer abs—not to mention the rest of that body. 10. KK and TW had good chemistry and made Clark and Lana believable, but KK and JR have insane chemistry, so VinCat sizzles. 11. So far the drama in Vincent and Catherine’s relationship comes from the outside, Clark and Lana’s drama was always internal, i.e. caused by the two of them. 12. Vincent and Cat work well together, see AMP or PIC for confirmation. Clark worked well with Chloe (because she stumbled across his secret), but he and Lana never really had the chance. So sad. 13. Smallville had killer music. Beauty and the Beast has stepped up since the early episodes, but they still have a way to go before I have burned my own BATB mix. Well, that’s my list. Comments? Additions? Arwenfan, I admit I've never seen Smallville, though I did check out their kissing scenes on youtube, as several were comparing them to Vincent and Catherine... No comparison, IMO...  However, your analysis of the relationship with VinCat is exactly right! Love all your points, thanks for putting all these thoughts down! Though I do think the music is pretty awesome and do have a BATB playlist going... LOL... |
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Post by ArwenFan on Apr 12, 2013 22:06:46 GMT -5
Thanks for reading, Darcy. I am working on a BATB playlist. They got me interested when they used Depeche Mode (I love them). Now, they just need to use something from Coldplay and I'll be happy.  |
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jeje
Army Recruit
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Post by jeje on Apr 12, 2013 22:37:41 GMT -5
Omg you just brought back all my bad memories from Smallville lol. I was a big Clana shipper but that whole relationship was written terribly. I hated that they never could be a normal happy couple for more then like 1 episode.
I always thought the writers waited WAYYYY too long for Lana to find out Clark's secret. Dragging it out for 6 seasons was ridiculous, it was like beating a dead horse over and over again. By the time Lana finally found out I didn't even really care anymore because I was just so over it.
I find BATB really refreshing because of many of the reasons you pointed out. For the most part Vincent and Catherine are very open and honest with each other, if they have an issue they talk about it. I also like that Catherine isn't the 'damsel in distress' that Vincent has to constantly save, she saves him just as much if not more than he saves her. These 2 work best as a couple and while I'm fine with a little angst here and there, its expected no relationship is perfect, I hope the writers continue to NOT go the 'back and forth, will they won't they" route.
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Apr 13, 2013 3:27:06 GMT -5
^ Never saw Smallville BUT I was curious with Welling/Kreuk kissing scenes so I did youtube those LOL..I must say you can't compare the Ryan/Kreuk kisses! Maybe cause Kristin is more mature and confident when it comes to kissing scenes..Either way can't compare! Just look at my sig LOL
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Post by jaykris on Apr 13, 2013 8:55:34 GMT -5
I was a huge Clana fan back in the day and they did have wonderful chemistry but definitely were a lot more reserved with most of their kissing scenes. Not that they didn't use tongue on occasion but I think, more on TW's part because he was married, he kept it more professional. No matter, Kristin has stated that she adores him and I honestly feel that she did have a crush on him. She did say in interviews that TW is absolutely her type of guy. A couple of kisses they had that were more intense can be seen here: www.youtube.com/watch?v=GQxIDKyruc4www.youtube.com/watch?v=FY8lmZMIMhwwww.youtube.com/watch?v=BulytTW0gY4www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrrU79mGm0cwww.youtube.com/watch?v=-4e_h0x5yTEwww.youtube.com/watch?v=n31GjctESukI have to admit, at the time, I thought these were so hot but after seeing Jay with Kristin and their kissing/make out scenes, they blow Clana out of the water. I think it's a combination of several factors. One, Kristin is older and more confident now, has had a lot of practice with kissing TW and other actors. 2, Vincat are a more mature and open with one another couple, with no secrets/lies in the way. 3, neither Jay or Kristin are married. Yes they are involved with other people, but not completely taken, taken as in marriage taken so maybe they are both more willing to enjoy some freedom with one another in their scenes. I always saw that KK is open to using tongue in kissing scenes but it depends on both actors involved. So where as TW was a bit more reluctant to use too much tongue in their kissing scenes, Jay from day 1 has shown KK that he doesn't seem to mind and KK also is comfortable with that so let the tongue bath begin. I just find that with the Vincat team, I get such strong, intense, obsessed feelings when the two are together, more so than I did with Clana. Love them so much. |
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Post by Suzieq ❤️ Beastie on Apr 13, 2013 9:43:08 GMT -5
The Clark and Lana "Red" Kiss......OMG!!....the Gold Standard, in my humble opinion! Seriously...look at it.....that kiss almost made Lana faint! www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkWeFLX5Av4&list=PL6EB366FCC1DC5237  I must say though, Vincent and Catherine are heating up the screen as well. I think they have those romantic elements of a more mature couple willing to open up themselves completely......no holding back, that is why it seems sexier. With Clark and Lana, they weren't completely free with each other till much later and they were finally honest with each other......by then the Mythology was knocking on the door and you knew their happiness wasn't going to last long. Have been a Smallville fan for many years.........I just can't compare SV and BaTB..........Superman vs. the Beast.......Clark and Lana vs. Vincent and Catherine.......A Superhero that would never kill, and a sympathetic, unwilling vigilante that has killed. Both have some very emotional and powerful moments between the romantic leads. which grabs the imagination. I adore the chemistry of TW and KK ........it was instant and undeniable!! The chemistry of JR and KK grew on me........and now I am thoroughly IN.....but it is more enjoyable in many ways because there is not so much angst. (that is why I hated the Alex/Vincent storyline!!  ) With Clark and Lana, the storyline was always back and forth of getting them together.......as soon as they got together, something always tore them apart. With Vincent and Catherine, the relationship is now there and the storyline will be how they will learn to endure and stay together. Like KK said at Wondercon, they want to see how VinCat deal with all these issues together. |
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Post by ArwenFan on Apr 13, 2013 11:54:34 GMT -5
Omg you just brought back all my bad memories from Smallville lol. I was a big Clana shipper but that whole relationship was written terribly. I hated that they never could be a normal happy couple for more then like 1 episode.  Glad I could be your blast from the past. Seriously! It drove me insane that Clana could not have a moment's peace or a smooth relationship for any length of time. I can't tell you how many times I wanted to personally find their offices and jab pens into their eyes.  Preaching to the choir.  From your lips to their ears. Thanks for reading! |
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Post by ArwenFan on Apr 13, 2013 11:57:09 GMT -5
^ Never saw Smallville BUT I was curious with Welling/Kreuk kissing scenes so I did youtube those LOL..I must say you can't compare the Ryan/Kreuk kisses! Maybe cause Kristin is more mature and confident when it comes to kissing scenes..Either way can't compare! Just look at my sig LOL Yolie, I agree that age and experience has improved KK's willingness to go all out in love scenes, but there were still a couple of Smallville kisses that set the standard IMHO. The Red kiss was, is, and remains yummy, sensual and hot.  |
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Post by ArwenFan on Apr 13, 2013 12:19:41 GMT -5
I was a huge Clana fan back in the day and they did have wonderful chemistry but definitely were a lot more reserved with most of their kissing scenes. Not that they didn't use tongue on occasion but I think, more on TW's part because he was married, he kept it more professional. No matter, Kristin has stated that she adores him and I honestly feel that she did have a crush on him. She did say in interviews that TW is absolutely her type of guy. A couple of kisses they had that were more intense can be seen here: www.youtube.com/watch?v=GQxIDKyruc4www.youtube.com/watch?v=FY8lmZMIMhwwww.youtube.com/watch?v=BulytTW0gY4www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrrU79mGm0cwww.youtube.com/watch?v=-4e_h0x5yTEwww.youtube.com/watch?v=n31GjctESukI have to admit, at the time, I thought these were so hot but after seeing Jay with Kristin and their kissing/make out scenes, they blow Clana out of the water. I think it's a combination of several factors. One, Kristin is older and more confident now, has had a lot of practice with kissing TW and other actors. 2, Vincat are a more mature and open with one another couple, with no secrets/lies in the way. 3, neither Jay or Kristin are married. Yes they are involved with other people, but not completely taken, taken as in marriage taken so maybe they are both more willing to enjoy some freedom with one another in their scenes. I always saw that KK is open to using tongue in kissing scenes but it depends on both actors involved. So where as TW was a bit more reluctant to use too much tongue in their kissing scenes, Jay from day 1 has shown KK that he doesn't seem to mind and KK also is comfortable with that so let the tongue bath begin. I just find that with the Vincat team, I get such strong, intense, obsessed feelings when the two are together, more so than I did with Clana. Love them so much. , thanks so much for the visual walk down memory lane. It's better to see snapshots of how good Clark and Lana were instead of having to sit through 4,950 minutes of torture to get there. I remember reading somewhere that TW had a thing about using tongue in scripted love scenes. IRC, he was of the opinion that you had to cross a lot of boundaries to do justice to your character and the situation he was in, so he felt strongly that something so personal and intimate (like french kissing) should be reserved for his real-life relationship. I respected him for that. I also remember hearing that KK used body doubles in her intimate scenes, and I can understand that, too. She was very young when she was in Smallville. I'm thankful that both she and JR are bringing their A games to V/C love scenes. Now back to that make-out scene in the barn. I still love that episode. I crack up every time Martha asks Clark why he's wearing his shirt inside out and Jonathan gives her a look. |
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Post by ArwenFan on Apr 13, 2013 12:30:53 GMT -5
The Clark and Lana "Red" Kiss......OMG!!....the Gold Standard, in my humble opinion! Seriously...look at it.....that kiss almost made Lana faint! /quote] You ain't just whistling Dixie, sister. I agree about KK/TW's chemistry, but her chemistry with JR is in-your-face intense. As for Alex, am I the only one who wasn't really bothered by her? She was a great touchstone for Vincent because we got to see what he was like before the experiment; a sweet, easygoing, fun-loving guy whose chosen profession meant the world to him, among other things. I still can't believe that professional, well-paid writers couldn't come up with dramatic situations that didn't include killing your power couple. I'm hoping that Kelly and Brian's writing duties are kept to a minimum and that Koslow has a strong voice in the series as it progresses. |
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Apr 14, 2013 2:34:51 GMT -5
Forget about kissing! This performance by KK made cry just now  ..Must be lack of sleep LOL ..NOT really I get very emotional with stuff like that. |
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Post by evanarose on Apr 14, 2013 3:24:20 GMT -5
Wow it's hard Smallville vs Batb! I love them both! I'm curious though, aside from the making out scenes who do you guys think has the better chemistry? Like based on those 1:1 heart to heart scenes, tension type of scenes...Seeing kristom vs Jay and Kristin in interviews... Like I agree...I respect TW if he prefers not to use tongue/go past light making out but I think seeing Jay doing the extra and Kristin, it does make it more convincing i.e. seeing Cat at the start stroke his cheek (even though they weren't in a relationship yet at that stage.), giving a reassuring pat and Vincent (in the relationship.) squeezing Cat tight at the rooftop...Jay didn't do that much at the start but I know Vincents character was cautious at that stage. What makes it even better is when you see Kristin and Jay in interviews, it doesn't seem to affect them! You can tell both actors seem comfortable and respect each other and there doesn't seem to be any problem. I think what helps is that Jay is funny, appears relaxed so that helps Kristin be relaxed also. I always got the impression TW is abit more tense about these scenes which may have made Kristin feel nervous but at the same time it works for him as his character as Clark is always tense and Lana because she knows he got a secret to hide I think TW and Kristin did improve with that as smallville went on though..I mean Kristin was young when Smallville started and the age difference b/t Tom and Kristin is greater. 5 years isn't much but it may feel abit being 19 and 24 (Tom engaged.) season 1. I don't know if the writers made clana develop slowly because of that also on top of the whole secret thing, etc. But I think the red-k Clark did steam clana up! Since he wasn't as afraid of what to say and I think Lana liked that part of him (not so much the rebelling though.) You could tell Tom enjoyed playing the red-k clark! I haven't seen smallville for awhile but if I recall before clana had a relationship they didn't really do that thing as much (the friendship body language gestures.)? It was more about the facial expressions. I mean it makes sense clana were younger, so there's abit of that teenage, chemistry tension most of the time. Also Lana did have a couple of relationships and at one stage Clark with Alicia...so when clana were together, I think that stopped them from getting as close as Catherine and Vincent as friends. Also the fact that in batb, neither Catherine or Vincent are in a relationship (I don't count Alex lol.) so I think that allows them to be more free and not worry about somebody getting jealous of them. Lana didn't know Clarks secret til Season 6, which obviously was THE MAIN BARRIER. Catherine knew about Vincent from the 1st episode. Probably if Lana knew Clarks secret from the start, there may have been more of the comforting friendship actions. I mean after Lana knew Clarks secret I'd say clana was closer to vincats level (Season 7.) but Lana had changed after the Lex thing *gag* which brought on the barrier of their full potential again. Personally I thought, the best clana was when Clark told his secret and proposed to her at the artic, but we know the ending to that episode *sigh* and the start of season 5 where Clark was human and didn't have the world on his shoulders.. |
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Post by evanarose on Apr 14, 2013 4:22:59 GMT -5
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Apr 14, 2013 5:17:15 GMT -5
^ Proof my point as much as the moments with Lana and Clark were sweet they were luke warm in comparison to Vincent and Catherine...Those two not only have sweet moments but they totally sizzle! IMO..This I think is to how KK matured as an actress and her age difference between shows progressed. Very nice stuff though..a few moments there had me moved.
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) 
Glad I could be your blast from the past. Seriously! It drove me insane that Clana could not have a moment's peace or a smooth relationship for any length of time. 
..Must be lack of sleep LOL ..NOT really I get very emotional with stuff like that.
