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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2013 4:30:18 GMT -5
Oh yes. For those who were wondering whether or not Vincent fights Zack for attacking Catherine the answer is YES!! And it was a great action Beast-on-Beast scene!! First, as soon as he finds out that Cat was attacked he comes to her apartment to make sure she's okay. After seeing her, he promises her that the beast will never hurt her again! When he does find him he goes all beastly and wild on him!! He just punches the *ell out of him while the other guy is all like 'Vincent! Hey it's me! Zack your buddy!' But Vincent is relentless until he has a flashback. We saw during Hothead how powerful and strong the flashbacks were and how they affect Vincent. I think we need to cut the guy some slack here. He has and is going through a tough period but he will emerge from it triumphant and a far better person
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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Nov 4, 2013 4:33:11 GMT -5
I see what you're saying. I agree with you to some extent. I have to be honest I am more shocked about Cat's attitude towards Vincent in this episode. Granted she knows its not his fault but she is obviously fed up with beasts infringing on the simplest of things in her life. She treated him like a nuisance this whole episode IMO and complained while her friends pretty much cheered her on. The warm fuzzy ending from episode 4 is now where to be found. She jumped out of her skin when he was at the window,something she never did and basically excoriated him for not using the front door. That personally shocked me. Has he ever. I saw this as the beginning of the end or at least that is what they want us to think and they want us to think that Gabe is a viable option for her especially now that he is supposedly not a beast. They laid that on thick and I think if anything judging by Vincent looking at Gabe walk to "look after her" (something he can't do) he may just give her up thinking that is what she needs or wants or just deserves. He realized what she has given up. He said so and he was surprised by her feeling about having to put up with him. He may push her away. She was all nice to Gabe while Vincent is inviting trouble for her apparently which he realized to. She was pushing him away IMO . So I guess she could flirt with idea of a more suitable alternative now like with Gabe than to a life with a beast. She obviously wants to be sympathetic to Vincent but is so caught up in the drama. The relationship is off the rails. They both are going to have along way back. Im just nervous of the mistakes they will make that will put them in that position. This episode has me pessimistic. The only way they can make Cats relationship with Evan different than Gabe is if they actually make her semi-intrestested. IMO Yikes!!! The wedge is being created because Vincent is not himself and Cat doesn't know who she is either. It's the blind leading the blind. LOL OMG! U may be right u know! I noticed cat being very disconnected from Vincent too but did not read much into it! I thought it was get needed à bit of time to herself but after reading What u wrote and thinking about some of thé things she Saïd What you say makes total sensé!!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2013 4:36:34 GMT -5
And as for Vincent cheating on Alex I agree with Pippin. We don't have all the details and plus Vincent and Alex
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Post by kiki09 on Nov 4, 2013 4:51:49 GMT -5
And as for Vincent cheating on Alex I agree with Pippin. We don't have all the details and plus Vincent and Alex Agreed. I don't think we have ever been told the full story on pre-Muirfield Vincent Keller. We don't actually know who he is. Besides that, you made a very good point about Vincent with regards to his memories. In the bar scene with Zach, I think he comes to the realization that all memories are not necessarily good and like you said Zena, that he may have not been the best guy in the past. Vincent definitely showed that realization all over his face.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2013 4:53:37 GMT -5
I don't think anyone has mentioned this yet but in this episode we see Vincent starting to question the killing of other beasts. I think it took finding his army buddy and seeing in his own eyes what has been done to him and the hate that he has been living with that has driven him to become this killer to start to realise that 'they', being all the beasts, are victims of Muirfield and that they were once good citizens who have been through *ell as a result of these tests and special program. Even when he gets the orders to kill Zack, Vincent questions Reynolds and urges him to give him time to help his friend see the light. I hope we get to see this develop through the rest of the season where instead of Vincent killing all these beasts, he finds them and rescues them and helps them get rid of all the hate and discover their true inner selves!
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Post by Catherine Chandler on Nov 4, 2013 5:33:06 GMT -5
Another thing I like is Cat's me time . Although It didn't last. It was about time she wanted that for herself There was one thing I thought it sucked. Someone mentioned it on here. The music when they were kissing. Seriously who chose that music? IMO it was really bad.
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Post by ragulr25 on Nov 4, 2013 5:46:34 GMT -5
At the end of the episode I was left with my heart breaking for Vincent! I just want to hug him! You guys are talking about how he cheated on Alex and his treatment of Gabriella, J.T and Catherine while I saw this episode as the beginning of Vincent's path to true self-discovery! It is clear that by the end of the episode Vincent is kind of shocked at what he has discovered about his former life and some of the decisions he made. When Zack tells him about Gabriella he was quick to ask 'But wasn't I engaged to this Alex girl?' I think he is discovering that he wasn't a good friend or guy in the past. The new Vincent 2.0 will also be a stronger and better man BECAUSE of Catherine and that's what he tells her during the last scene. That if it wasn't for HER and HER LOVE he would also still be lost I also had the feeling after watching that final Vincent/Gabe scene that Vincent feels and senses that Gabe has feelings for Catherine and indirectly asks him to keep an eye out for her because he realised after the whole reunion party that she needs the normal guy. That end scene where Gabe enters the hall where Catherine is sitting while Vincent exits then turns and watches him had great symbolism! One entering Catherine's life while the other is leaving. We know that VinCat is end game and Catherine will never love another guy like she loves Vincent but I don't mind the tension and angst I have a feeling that the writers have a huge prize for us in store when Vincent finally fully remembers J.T and Catherine! They're going to be beautiful and memorable scenes! that last vin/gabe scene u commented was perfect.i get a feeling that too. and with cat becoming frustruated cuz she doesnt have normal life.she was jealous of other classmates of her . this gabe/cat thing is gonna take some serious terms looks like writers r going with cat/gabe storyline anyway
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Post by feezya on Nov 4, 2013 5:55:23 GMT -5
I woke up and there are already EIGHT pages of this thread!!
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Post by panda98 on Nov 4, 2013 5:55:41 GMT -5
^^Zena I totally agree with your points from the flashback to Vincent questioning Reynolds. Pretty much what I was thinking but wasn't going to write till I watched it again. Haha Well I had a quick post of somethings especially the flashback. It was quick, nothing big. Vincent did have a reaction which is a very appropriate one when he found out that she got attacked. Their first great fighting scene in the church. He was beating Zack up pretty good then he started to have memories because Zack was reaching out to him then triggered memories of them. Which is why he was calm and buddy buddy when Vincent introduced Zack to Catherine. Love your Ross and Rachel gif. The end scene. I did notice how Vincent looked at Gabe when he was walking away. I was like "He knows!" or senses something. I loved the VinCat scene. They are starting to be more honest with each other and telling how they feel and talking it out, which is one of the reasons why I love the show. They actually talk things out, try to find common ground, meet in the middle. It was sad at the same time though. Catherine really wanting to have a beast free day to enjoy her reunion but she couldn't. Vincent realizing how Catherine felt and just wanting for the missions to end so he can make it up to her, to be with her and not have to deal with the chaos of beasts come at them. I like this pace. Slowly but surely they are building their relationship again. When the slow dance came, I was expecting them to dance but they didn't. Kinda disappointed but not really. I don't think the setting was right to have one. Vincent questioning Reynolds. One thought came into my mind was, would Vincent have flashbacks without Catherine? Either way Zack would have been looking for Vincent and they would have a beast and beast fight then Zack will be like " I know you, Vincent it's me Zack". Would Vincent have had that flashback? He probably would have them later on and not as soon as he is now because of Catherine. I know he is questioning now because of Catherine's influence, because of her he wants to remember again. He wants to remember his memories with her and be able to be with her. Plus he has JT and Catherine to tell him about himself which will raise more curiosity and changing how he approaches things now. But if he didn't have JT and Catherine, would Vincent have tried to just not think about it and be the super solider or actually be more curious and still try to reason with Zack. IMO it probably would take longer. But eventually he will start to question Reynolds and start trying to try and reason with other beasts. Through Zack, he saw what he could have become had Catherine not came into his life. He was starting to see the effects of what Muirfield did to them and how he feels about it.
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Post by bookworm on Nov 4, 2013 6:14:31 GMT -5
For me this was another V-centered episode. He is starting to think like a man not as a beast when he wants to reason with Zack. He thinks he can save him and get to his human side. I think this is a good sign of V's getting back his humanity.
He also just realized what kind of life Cat has to put up with just because of him. He's beginning to understand the toll their relationship has taken on her personal life. She has no social life, no friends (only Tess who is in the know) lost both parents and now not sure about her dad. So basically her life is a chaos. The mess would be big enough without him but she is still determined to be with him. He respects that now. Maybe the old guilt will begin to surface in him soon because of this.
Cat tried to have one night "off" from the craziness but with not much success. She probably knows now she'll never have a normal life with everything going on and it's really heavy on her shoulders. It's nice to see that V understood this.
Well I noticed V's look when he thought about what Gabe said. V realized Cat has become important to Gabe but we don't know how far that'll develop or if it's a one-sided crush. Cat is not into G right now but she's beginning to see the friend in him. He was the "enemy" for a long time but things changed. He's there for her and this could become a strong friendship. I think V will keep an eye on Gabe too from now on.
I found the VinCat time altogether was less than I expected because most of the time they were interrupted or there was a fight. The kiss and V's confession was sweet, though.
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Post by bookworm on Nov 4, 2013 6:22:46 GMT -5
I'm starting to believe that one day Dr & Mrs Keller will be living in Colorado, with 3 kids and a dog! And Granddad Reynolds will be living down the street, babysitting on "Date nights"!!! [/font][/quote]
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Post by feezya on Nov 4, 2013 6:22:54 GMT -5
The super hot scene with the "other" women in the flashback scene only because it shows hints that when Vincent does get back with Catherine in forth coming episodes, there with be much more mature "sexy time" going on. LOL!!! Back soon ... ha ha ha… really hope so. first impression when seeing that scene "Myyyy Vincent WAS a dawg!!" And i saw TONGUE later one I just have to say that; even if it's just a little bit.. It was quite disturbing to see Vincent make out with some other girl, even if it was in the past, before Cat. And when Vincat finally get back together and have their reunion, as much as we want it, I don't think we'll see anything nearly this sexy or provocative. Why? Simply because KK does not like to show her body. She will never do a scene where she is wearing her bra and panties. She's always going to be under the bed covers. But man would I love to see her do a scene like that with JR. I'd die happy. ME TOOOO!! So Vincent was cheating on Alex while he was in Army?? That may change my opinion about him a little bit. Hope he never does that to Catherine! Obviously he didn't love Alex as much as she thought if he could cheat! Not that I'm an Alex fan, but it is still wrong! This is exactly what I was wondering about - if I'm gonna need the angry smileys. So, let me get this straight . . . V just got into the army, was supposedly in love with Alex - sending her love letters home and all - and decided to cheat on her?!?!? I'm sooooooo not liking how they are changing V's character right now. I hope I am wrong about this when I watch tomorrow. oh oh… i bet this thread will be on fire tomorrow and the writers or whoever are involved will be getting some huge beating WOW .... So strange how we all think so differently. So quick with the judgments on this thread! So here are my two cents ... First and foremost JT said, that he had broken up with Alex for a short while before he joined the Army and the fling was very short lived. Now just to recap Vincent's state of mind at the time from what we know, he had just lost both his brothers in the Twin Towers and had definitely lost his way before he joined the Army. Anyone who has suffered from bereavement, will tell you that the loss of a beloved one can make you do crazy things! In multiple episodes Vincent has talked about his state of mind before and after he joined the Army. Perhaps once deployed Vincent realized, that he did what to be without his childhood sweetheart Alex after all? Well said
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Post by feezya on Nov 4, 2013 6:30:31 GMT -5
Okay, I'm going to chime in here. I found a download and I watched it. I think, to a certain extent some of the Alex arc was poorly portrayed... and I would have to go back and rewatch some of the between the scenes scenes from S1 to describe the state of their relationship when he left. But it was my understanding up until tonight, that he really left her when he left to join the army. Later, somehow they reconnected through letters/phone calls whatever. This is based on the impression I got during season 1. So, yes, they were on a break, and yes, he had some sort of a fling during that time. JT is there in Reunion to verify this part of the story. The love letters, obviously, came later. This Gabriela person isn't important, that much is very clear, she is only important because Zach pushes Vincent to remember her so that he can turn on Vincent. It is also so that Zach can justify hurting both Vincent and Catherine... She may be a tangent, but it really isn't about her. It has more to do with how Zach lost his humanity and ultimately how Catherine helps Vincent find his. So, in typical beastie fashion, we may be missing the point. I'm not trying to offend anyone, just telling it as I see it. Remembering the "sexy scene" with Gabriela was just the trigger point for Zach... It wasn't about Vincent's memories of her. And seeing how lost Zach is - who he has become - in the absence of her, well that brings it all back for Vincent, to Catherine. It is actually kind of romantic. That is my official two cents. Watch before you make snap judgments. It is sad to see Vincent so desperate to regain his memories, that his judgment or instincts actually seem a bit off with Zach. He wants so much to remember his friend, that he doesn't see the enemy standing right in front of him. It's sad. I'm sure I will have more to say tomorrow, but I just wanted to try to put out the fire. I'm not a person of many words but you really put it down well. I love this episode, i really do. i think the series are getting better and better as the season unfold. Its kind of frustrating the whole picture is spoilt because of little and minor stuff
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Post by feezya on Nov 4, 2013 6:37:56 GMT -5
Okay, I'm going to chime in here. I found a download and I watched it. I think, to a certain extent some of the Alex arc was poorly portrayed... and I would have to go back and rewatch some of the between the scenes scenes from S1 to describe the state of their relationship when he left. But it was my understanding up until tonight, that he really left her when he left to join the army. Later, somehow they reconnected through letters/phone calls whatever. This is based on the impression I got during season 1. So, yes, they were on a break, and yes, he had some sort of a fling during that time. JT is there in Reunion to verify this part of the story. The love letters, obviously, came later. This Gabriela person isn't important, that much is very clear, she is only important because Zach pushes Vincent to remember her so that he can turn on Vincent. It is also so that Zach can justify hurting both Vincent and Catherine... She may be a tangent, but it really isn't about her. It has more to do with how Zach lost his humanity and ultimately how Catherine helps Vincent find his. So, in typical beastie fashion, we may be missing the point. I'm not trying to offend anyone, just telling it as I see it. Remembering the "sexy scene" with Gabriela was just the trigger point for Zach... It wasn't about Vincent's memories of her. And seeing how lost Zach is - who he has become - in the absence of her, well that brings it all back for Vincent, to Catherine. It is actually kind of romantic. That is my official two cents. Watch before you make snap judgments. It is sad to see Vincent so desperate to regain his memories, that his judgment or instincts actually seem a bit off with Zach. He wants so much to remember his friend, that he doesn't see the enemy standing right in front of him. It's sad. I'm sure I will have more to say tomorrow, but I just wanted to try to put out the fire. I was lucky and got to download it as well (Thank you Canadian friends that uploaded it ) . I would have to agree with you on the Alex thing but since we had to live through it, at least it made V sound like he was a committed man. I think this Gabriela thing was a total tangent. Even though you said it was not about her, I felt like the writers could have done a better job portraying the message they intended. I thought V was quick to forgive Zach for attacking Cat. I found that irritating. Look how long it's taking for V to trust Cat and all of a sudden, one memory and Zach is a "good guy". I feel like the writers are neglecting JT and V's friendship. Yes, they had a movie night in this episode but V still doesn't remember him. The writers had V remember his entire friendship with Zach before he remembers even 1 memory of JT. Really? The look on JT's face. And then when V told JT he can go home, ugh! I get it's a small detail but really? I dunno, I need to rewatch it. Yup sad for JT especially at the bar. I guess being with JT hasn't triggered as much (or any memory) as Vincent would like to, thus he opted being with Zach because he had several already within the short moment they were together. but i'm looking at the glass half full here, i am sure we'll have an chapter concentrating on JT and Vincent. If my memory serves me well, Austin did mention people will discover about him too, why he stuck with Vincent through the whole 10 years when he was in hiding...
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Post by feezya on Nov 4, 2013 6:43:23 GMT -5
Oh My!!! Our Little Beastie Show is all growed up!!! S02 just keeps getting better & better! It's tight, fast paced & before you know it, the hour is over. Even after reading some of the posts [that I really disagree with], I can't get the smile off my face! IMO opinion, Vincent is a total LOVE from beginning to end! The "warm fuzzies" just won't go away.
It's so interesting how people can interpret the same scene. OK, as I saw things: - Vincent comes through the window, hoping to trigger some "memories". Catherine is waiting for her friends, having a Pre-Reunion" girls night & sweetly tells him that she's taking a "Me time" & he should do the same by spending time with JT. "Don't sprain your ankle on the way down". - The Mayor is ragging on Gabe to solve "beast related cases". Catherine is trying to trace her birth father & has asked Gabe for help. Tess really needs to get laid so she'll stop with the Catherine/Gabe innuendos! Friend or not, it is none of her business! - Apparently, Catherine always went for "bad boys" who are now probably all in jail or re-hab. "The Projects, broken wings, shower them with love & try to save them." Sound familiar? JT & Vincent have quality time with the Snack Bowls. Zack shows up & attacks Catherine. Very nasty!! Catherine fights back, he jumps through her window when her friend comes in. - Gabe goes to JT's, says Catherine was attacked. Great Gabe scene, tries casual, friendly voice! Vincent goes "Flash Gordon" & is off hunting the beast! Finds him & beast-on-beast fight. Zack says they're friends. Vincent has flashbacks. - Catherine gets to JT's. Z & V arrive, Zack is all charming. The guys go out to Soldier Bar. Zack brings up Gabriella & won't let up, trying to trigger memories.. Vincent says, "thought I was engaged to someone named Alex". JT: "yeah, but you were going off to war & you & Alex sort of separated". JT feeling very uneasy. Vincent has flashbacks of Gabriella. Zack threatens him. At the Station: Reynolds at Gabe's office, heard Catherine was assaulted & wants to know she's OK. Says he promised her 'uhmm', father to look after her. Gabe tells him if he wants to help, can the FBI help find her birth father. Reynolds: "sure, see what I can do". At Reunion: - The Grad Class is collecting for a school pool. Catherine is told that every August her father gave a generous donation. Even after he died in July. Dum De Dum Dum!! Tess & Gabe show up. - Reynolds tells Vincent that Zack slaughtered Gabriella. He's on Hit List. Vincent thinks he can reach him, it's Muirfield's fault. Zack threatens to kill Catherine. Vincent comes to protect her. Keeps saying he's sorry. Zack [mascot suit] attacks Catherine. Vincent goes ballistic, beast-on-beast fight. Vincent snaps his neck. Scene at Stage: Vincent in Dr mode, since Catherine was knocked out. Another "I'm sorry, Catherine" speech. I could just hug him!!! Promises that when missions are over, he'll make it all up to her! Without her, he'd be lost like Zack! That kiss was Swoonworthy!!!! Loved how he closed his eyes!! - In hallway, Gabe asks Vincent "how's Catherine?" Vincent: "I think she'll be fine. But I'd keep an eye on her". Gabe: "Will do". I feel Vincent realizes Gabe has feelings for Catherine. No jealousy. - Catherine tells Gabe that she appreciates all he's done, shows Gabe old, school pictures. At her Grad, in the background is Reynolds! Catherine: "I think I just found my birth father".
Each episode has me wishing it was next Sunday so I could watch E06. This Season, BatB has become my addiction of choice!! I want more! It's like getting tangled in a web and I don't want to break free!
I loved everything about this episode! Even Tess couldn't spoil the magic. Catherine & Vincent's relationship is becoming one of trust, deep caring & appreciation of each other. They are both voicing their feelings & hopes for their future together. I'm starting to believe that one day Dr & Mrs Keller will be living in Colorado, with 3 kids and a dog! And Granddad Reynolds will be living down the street, babysitting on "Date nights"!!!
Aaaawwwwww this is a beautiful recap Have that warm fuzzy feeling too..
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