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Post by AlisongladaboutSeason4 on Jul 4, 2016 10:22:57 GMT -5
About Jt & T: I have the impressione that they are now like a previous state of Vincent and Cat as a couple. JT is not self confident so he needs Tess to be near him to "save" him while he is trying to do the difference in the world in his own way. I understand Hill's point of view, but he has to gain more information about a strange creature before face it :-) but he won't have another chance... sorry. And Vincent I think will be so so sorry for what happened, like someone else said it is impossible that he will exit this situation without some form of regret for not being able to save Hill or the commander (i can't remember his name): in fact he killed two "innocent" people, plus Vincent is alive only because the commander saved him years ago and now Vincent is the reason why he is dead; Hill IMO just freaked out and tried to solve his situation alone all the sequence between Hill and Vincent is beautifully shot and played. I think Kyle will make his own research about Heather's family: if in first place he could add the strange behaviour of the girl to a "i don't know what I feel for this guy" problem, now it is clear that she is hiding something big... I don't know if he is the bad guy (IMO in this case he would be less surprised or disappointed by Heather behaviour), but maybe he will try to find out what is going on putting his and Heather life in danger I don't think Commander Fuller was dead. Vincent rescued him from the debris after the bomb blast and patched him up before he told Vincent to get out of there. It seems that he didn't shoot Vincent all those years ago because he saw something good in him still, despite the beast experiments. All the other super-soldiers were, it seems, too far gone and could not have been brought back from their killer states, but Vincent was different. It was quite a touching scene as he said to Vincent 'still trying to save people, Vincent? Even now'. Really don't have a lot of sympathy for Hill and I personally would not call him 'innocent'. He knew what Vincent had already done for DHS, taking down Liam Cullen and even saving Hill and his family from bounty hunters. He knew that Vincent was in control but decided to take away that control (by pumping him so full of adrenaline) in order to give himself an excuse to murder Vincent in cold blood. Why? Because he was getting a little too much heat in his job? Not the actions of an honourable man, I think. I don't know what it is about season 4 but the scripts are sooo much better than season 3. Not so much repetition and the dialogue just seems so much more natural and believable. The final scene was just heart-braking. When are our VinCat going to get a brake? The final conversation where Cat says 'We'll get through it, we've survived worse', and Vincent says 'If only that were true, but I'll never give you up so we'll have to find a way' or words to that effect. Oh my God, those words plus the hug that backs up his words. I was on the floor after this episode. VinCat chemistry is back, and is better than ever. All that, plus the steamy (in more ways than one) shower scene at the start. Can't wait for the next episode.
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Post by bbatb on Jul 4, 2016 10:31:25 GMT -5
And I have to add that Hill also planned on having Catherine killed too by the assassin who came to their apartment. THAT guy shot up their bed and would have killed them both had they still been in it.
Later on, Hill ordered his assassins to kill JT and Tess, too, by luring them to IL Cantuccio's. He was one nasty, murdering, deceitful coward! Does having 4 people killed qualify as a serial killer? In my book it does, but then I am not the forgiving kind!
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Post by bbatb on Jul 4, 2016 10:35:11 GMT -5
AlisongladaboutSeason4 LOL - it seems we posted almost simultaneously and we ARE on the same page regarding Fuller and Hill.
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Post by BeastieBoy on Jul 4, 2016 11:39:44 GMT -5
And I have to add that Hill also planned on having Catherine killed too by the assassin who came to their apartment. THAT guy shot up their bed and would have killed them both had they still been in it. Later on, Hill ordered his assassins to kill JT and Tess, too, by luring them to IL Cantuccio's. He was one nasty, murdering, deceitful coward! Does having 4 people killed qualify as a serial killer? In my book it does, but then I am not the forgiving kind! All I can say is that DHS has some idiots working for them. Hill's motives still has me a bit puzzled. He said it was due to his family being put in danger. I could see why perhaps it would cause someone to take drastic actions, but trying to kill the person (and everyone associated) who saved your family is nuts! Then there's the dumb and dumber duo of DHS internal affair agents. The dumber one comes in with his gun drawn saying "hands in the air" while approaching a fellow DHS agent, Cat. Who does that? LOL. Putting aside the ludicrous aspect of DHS, I felt this was one very well crafted episode. It's really a pleasant surprise how the writers have broken away from the S3 doldrums and served up something much better.
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Post by BeastieBoy on Jul 4, 2016 11:53:23 GMT -5
I like the way you edited out the interruptions, leaving in just the sexy time. BTW, Vincent says "how about that time right after we said I do". I was wondering if that was in reference to their honeymoon or their wedding night? I assumed it was their wedding night, which made me somewhat annoyed that we never got to see it! LOL.
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Post by bbatb on Jul 4, 2016 12:00:23 GMT -5
I like the way you edited out the interruptions, leaving in just the sexy time. BTW, Vincent says "how about that time right after we said I do". I was wondering if that was in reference to their honeymoon or their wedding night? I assumed it was their wedding night, which made me somewhat annoyed that we never got to see it! LOL. Yeah, the best things happen off screen away from the prying eyes of the viewers. Remember when Catherine said that they made love on the roof? Well, WE did not get to see THAT either. Or the extra handcuff episode. Well, THAT might have been to hot for American screens.
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Post by bbatb on Jul 4, 2016 12:04:21 GMT -5
And I have to add that Hill also planned on having Catherine killed too by the assassin who came to their apartment. THAT guy shot up their bed and would have killed them both had they still been in it. Later on, Hill ordered his assassins to kill JT and Tess, too, by luring them to IL Cantuccio's. He was one nasty, murdering, deceitful coward! Does having 4 people killed qualify as a serial killer? In my book it does, but then I am not the forgiving kind! All I can say is that DHS has some idiots working for them. Hill's motives still has me a bit puzzled. He said it was due to his family being put in danger. I could see why perhaps it would cause someone to take drastic actions, but trying to kill the person (and everyone associated) who saved your family is nuts! Then there's the dumb and dumber duo of DHS internal affair agents. The dumber one comes in with his gun drawn saying "hands in the air" while approaching a fellow DHS agent, Cat. Who does that? LOL. Putting aside the ludicrous aspect of DHS, I felt this was one very well crafted episode. It's really a pleasant surprise how the writers have broken away from the S3 doldrums and served up something much better. Totally agree about the DHS idiots and also about their security regarding the building. Anybody, and I mean ANYBODY marches in and out of there at will. There seem to be NO surveillance cameras AT ALL ANYWHERE and everybody is so totally surprised when they are breached. It really boggles the mind. They have a new bunch of writers and that seems to do the trick. Really enjoying myself here.
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Post by BeastieBoy on Jul 4, 2016 12:20:52 GMT -5
All I can say is that DHS has some idiots working for them. Hill's motives still has me a bit puzzled. He said it was due to his family being put in danger. I could see why perhaps it would cause someone to take drastic actions, but trying to kill the person (and everyone associated) who saved your family is nuts! Then there's the dumb and dumber duo of DHS internal affair agents. The dumber one comes in with his gun drawn saying "hands in the air" while approaching a fellow DHS agent, Cat. Who does that? LOL. Putting aside the ludicrous aspect of DHS, I felt this was one very well crafted episode. It's really a pleasant surprise how the writers have broken away from the S3 doldrums and served up something much better. Totally agree about the DHS idiots and also about their security regarding the building. Anybody, and I mean ANYBODY marches in and out of there at will. There seem to be NO surveillance cameras AT ALL ANYWHERE and everybody is so totally surprised when they are breached. It really boggles the mind. They have a new bunch of writers and that seems to do the trick. Really enjoying myself here. The best thing about S4 is that the VinCat chemistry is back! I can overlook the many plot holes, as long there's VinCat goodness in the mix. But it's not only VinCat, I'm enjoying all the characters more this season. I love the JT and Heather scenes too. Like when JT references Beverly Hills Cop and Heather's like "Huh?"...
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Post by bbatb on Jul 4, 2016 13:04:30 GMT -5
Yes and yes about the chemistry being back. And yes and yes about forgiving the plot holes. Just like we forgave the plot holes and sometimes lame 'cases of the week' in S1 for just THAT reason. Give us VinCat scenes and lots of them. They do not have to make love ALL the time and the do not have to be without clothes ALL the time. Have them work together and just be cute and loving and caring with each other - NOT like the S3 bickering and fighting and 'wine glass seperations'!
That 'banana' scene with Heather and JT was grrrreat. Also really loved the scene where Vincent exits the car blocks the road for the tv van and gets back into the car. Catherine was grinning and chuckling and Vincent was very pleased with himself. THAT is the cute stuff they do together and THAT is what we love.
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Post by batb217 on Jul 4, 2016 14:23:23 GMT -5
This episode definitely had more of a season 1 feel, purely because it DIDN'T finish with a happy ending. In Heart of Darkness we had a shocking event (Evan being shot) followed by a conversation between Vincent and Catherine in which they realise how bad things are (their relationship will always be at risk if Muirfield are in the picture) and yet they also have a heartfelt moment ("I can't live without you"). And honestly, that scenes is one of the scenes from season one that has stuck in my head.
In comparison, we have 4x06: shocking event (Vincent killing Agent Hill), a conversation between Vincent and Catherine in which they realise how bad things are ("We've been through worse right?" "Yeah, I wish that were true") and a heartfelt moment (Vincent's last line as they hug).
Honestly, I was half expecting Vincent to be completely guilt ridden and for Catherine to have to calm him down, or convince him that it wasn't his fault (maybe I'll write a fic about that when I have the time) but actually the scene the show went with was beautiful. It shows how much they've grown as a couple. I really enjoyed this episode, I think it's my second favourite at of season four and certainly one of my favourites out of the whole series.
As I mentioned beforehand though, it is crucial that what happened to Vincent MUST be brought up in the following episode, because I think that's easily the most traumatic things he has done since ripping Kurt Windsors heart out. He isn't going to be okay about what he did and I think Catherine will also be worried about him (not about his control, just about how he is coping with what he has done). That's all for now!
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Post by missingalias on Jul 4, 2016 14:42:27 GMT -5
Oh forgot to mention earlier. I lived how the writer mocked beastie wishes through Vincent when VinCat were showering. When cat talked about the romantic moments of the past and he smirked of those times when all the people were trying to kill them. That was genuinely funny and a well deserved get back. Also we got notified again that when VinCat doens't agree (going into the military base) things go south. Much more Suttle nod this time but still there.
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Post by BeastieBoy on Jul 4, 2016 14:57:47 GMT -5
Oh forgot to mention earlier. I lived how the writer mocked beastie wishes through Vincent when VinCat were showering. When cat talked about the romantic moments of the past and he smirked of those times when all the people were trying to kill them. That was genuinely funny and a well deserved get back. Also we got notified again that when VinCat doens't agree (going into the military base) things go south. Much more Suttle nod this time but still there. I felt the writing was very clever in this episode. Kudos to Patti Carr. It was like Patti knew many of the beasties' complaints, there were parts where she lulled me into thinking "oh no, here we go again - just like before", but then she'd put in a twist that made the outcome of the scene very different. It was quite refreshing in that sense.
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Post by missingalias on Jul 4, 2016 15:30:44 GMT -5
I felt the writing was very clever in this episode. Kudos to Patti Carr. It was like Patti knew many of the beasties' complaints, there were parts where she lulled me into thinking "oh no, here we go again - just like before", but then she'd put in a twist that made the outcome of the scene very different. It was quite refreshing in that sense. that's true! I fully agree with you. She was really up to beasties standards and did it with such class that I have nothing to complain about.
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Post by AlisongladaboutSeason4 on Jul 4, 2016 16:02:27 GMT -5
AlisongladaboutSeason4 LOL - it seems we posted almost simultaneously and we ARE on the same page regarding Fuller and Hill. We sure are. And, we should also remember that the bomb Hill got Vincent to take into the Army Base injured Fuller and could have killed a lot of innocent people. He was willing to cause all that carnage just to take out Vincent, who had saved his life. What sort of person does that?
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rose
Army Recruit
Posts: 133
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Post by rose on Jul 4, 2016 18:47:05 GMT -5
I just finished watching the episode and I do think season 4 keeps getting better and better. I agree the episode has a season one feel and it did manage to keep me at the edge of my seat the entire episode. And Vincent is back to being a fugitive and living in the shadows. Halfway through the episode I started worrying that both Vincent and Cat were going to loose their jobs because I just don't see how they will be able to keep them after what has just happened.
I agree with the comments made so far I didn't feel sorry for Hill. I think he had it coming for biting more than he can chew. He should have known better given all the beast cover ups he had to do from past season. He should have known that poking the beast like that was a suicide mission. I just hope that in real life federal agents are smarter than him. But I suppose as is mostly the case most people behave in a selfish way and are more likey to throw someone else under the bus if it serves their purpose or if they feel like their positions are under threat.
I liked that they did not go the expected route, like I was happy that Cat was not able to talk Vincent down as one would expect after he got that shot from Hill. I was also glad that Vincent was not feeling sorry of himself after the fact as would have happened in season 1. I think they have come a long from where they were at in season 1 and are now more sure of who they are together. I am so looking forward to finding out where they go from here.
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