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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Jun 12, 2015 15:53:29 GMT -5
One more thing. In the opening scene, when they were getting ready to have time, I kept thinking: oh my, what if some old lady walks up to the roof wanting to enjoy the view, and gets a view she wasn't expecting! Lol! I'm assuming Cat isn't the only resident who uses the roof.
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Post by alwayscrazedbatbfan on Jun 12, 2015 15:59:07 GMT -5
I'm also wondering about Vincent's EYES. We have seen the Orange glow. But when before has he ever had that RED savage-like glow to the eyes. And I found the effect VERY interesting when Vincent stares at Catherine, and the eyes go immediately from red, through orange, and finally back to black. I DID like that the message that came through loud and clear was that Vincent NEVER seemed to turn his beast-rage towards Catherine. He was either going to ignore her or listen to her, but he WAS NOT ever at risk of attacking her. I do feel that the writers do NOT want to go down the path of the end of "Kidnapped" ever again. Epic Love does NOT need even the possibility of domestic violence to tarnish it (I am DEFINITELY with Spydancer on that one! There are still things from Season 2 that were just THAT bad--BUT I feel the writers are trying to address each and every one to show that VinCat will never again be in those places. Only time will tell.)
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Post by alwayscrazedbatbfan on Jun 12, 2015 16:09:30 GMT -5
HEY Anapi and Lisa,
STILL think, um, it was NOT a problem for VinCat --just have Catherine's body be leaning against the ROOF DOOR during -ahem- physical exertions!! They should be JUST FINE, unless of course the door opens inward. (HEEHEEHEE!)--What this show DOES to us and our thinking!!! Ode to the Dancing Banana Republic!!
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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Jun 12, 2015 16:47:02 GMT -5
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Post by cacosa on Jun 12, 2015 17:26:58 GMT -5
One more thing. In the opening scene, when they were getting ready to have time, I kept thinking: oh my, what if some old lady walks up to the roof wanting to enjoy the view, and gets a view she wasn't expecting! Lol! I'm assuming Cat isn't the only resident who uses the roof. That's a question I've always had ... How is it possible that with a so very great roof, we've never seen any Catherine's neighbor there?
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Jun 12, 2015 17:33:13 GMT -5
One more thing. In the opening scene, when they were getting ready to have time, I kept thinking: oh my, what if some old lady walks up to the roof wanting to enjoy the view, and gets a view she wasn't expecting! Lol! I'm assuming Cat isn't the only resident who uses the roof. That's a question I've always had ... How is it possible that with a so very great roof, we've never seen any Catherine's neighbor there? My thought is 'how many times' did they use that roof for and actually do the deed there lol.
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Post by Bill the beast on Jun 12, 2015 21:10:35 GMT -5
I've been enjoying the thoughtful comments of alwayscrazedbatbfan But I have some observations. As a one-time New Yorker, I wanna say people don't hang out on the rooftops much, at any time of day. That's just poetic license. But at night? You've gotta be kidding. One of the BatB cliches has been the window and the fire-escape but, please! Any such real situations would have padlocked bars on the windows. And even so, it's a risk. The first time I saw a BatB episode and Vincent just came to the unlocked window, I had a heart attack! So Cat & Vincent have the rooftops entirely to themselves, most any time. Not a problem. Good to read comments by @locaxbatb again. It has been too long, my friend. We talked about the issue of spoilers on BatB and Heartland. I've come to this conclusion for myself: my advice, don't watch anything that could be a spoiler. I know that's hard when you're starved for it but I've seen it too many times with episodes that are borderline, you tip it one way or the other all by yourself. To those worried about the pace, remember we only have 10 episodes for S3, right? Have to make allowances. Can't tell everything from this one episode but we've seen enough to be puzzled, intrigued. The implication of what we've seen in 3.01 is that there is some secret organization(s) experimenting on people. Yet we saw that at the end of S2 and I thought they were defeated by Sam and VinCat. JT and Tess work well enough for me @dave It's the attraction of opposites. But at a deeper level they are fundamentally similar. The proposal was 99.9% for me. Only one quibble, and I'm being old fashioned here, when Vincent took a knee, he should say her full name. "Catherine (middle) Chandler, will you do me the honor .... etc." Just my opinion. I should be thrilled that he even took a knee at all since he was going to stick the ring in a strawberry originally. Good God! Nicely balanced conflict of values. Cat CANNOT look at life in other terms than Vincent is not just her lover but her mission, her calling...? Vincent has had his fill of missions. Safety, normalcy is what he craves. Yet together they are lovers with a mission. Another theme about Cat is she is so headstrong, she is likely to make decisions for Vincent, without his being consulted. She was well aware of that danger in this episode and working hard to avoid it. So, that's more for the theme "we have grown through the trials of S2". I agree with alwayscrazedbatbfan that the two of them may still be tentative on what their union means. Finally, Season 2 began well and didn't begin to derail until episodes 7 or 8. I liked very much the moral conflict Cat was having over the "risk of Vincent's losing his humanity" - a reasonable worry considering his inner conflicts. That's why it was nice to revisit that conflict in this episode and see Vincent regain control (and avoid being shot by Cat). And I was willing to make allowances for Vincent being attracted to Tori, since she seemed to have the ability to amplify his powers and confuse his reasoning. He can't be held completely responsible. But by the time Catherine begins insisting she is "with Gabe", the rails have been left far behind. Mr. Kern had managed to completely erase everything that made S1 charming. I agree with @locaxbatb that the lesson has likely been learned. We certainly moaned and griped enough to be heard. That's Beastie Power! Remember all the critics who wanted BatB cancelled at the end of S2? One who is not to be named in particular... We will be heard. (I trust)
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Post by batb4evr1 on Jun 12, 2015 22:15:39 GMT -5
I've been enjoying the thoughtful comments of alwayscrazedbatbfan But I have some observations. As a one-time New Yorker, I wanna say people don't hang out on the rooftops much, at any time of day. That's just poetic license. But at night? You've gotta be kidding. One of the BatB cliches has been the window and the fire-escape but, please! Any such real situations would have padlocked bars on the windows. And even so, it's a risk. The first time I saw a BatB episode and Vincent just came to the unlocked window, I had a heart attack! So Cat & Vincent have the rooftops entirely to themselves, most any time. Not a problem. Good to read comments by @locaxbatb again. It has been too long, my friend. We talked about the issue of spoilers on BatB and Heartland. I've come to this conclusion for myself: my advice, don't watch anything that could be a spoiler. I know that's hard when you're starved for it but I've seen it too many times with episodes that are borderline, you tip it one way or the other all by yourself. To those worried about the pace, remember we only have 10 episodes for S3, right? Have to make allowances. Can't tell everything from this one episode but we've seen enough to be puzzled, intrigued. The implication of what we've seen in 3.01 is that there is some secret organization(s) experimenting on people. Yet we saw that at the end of S2 and I thought they were defeated by Sam and VinCat. JT and Tess work well enough for me @dave It's the attraction of opposites. But at a deeper level they are fundamentally similar. The proposal was 99.9% for me. Only one quibble, and I'm being old fashioned here, when Vincent took a knee, he should say her full name. "Catherine (middle) Chandler, will you do me the honor .... etc." Just my opinion. I should be thrilled that he even took a knee at all since he was going to stick the ring in a strawberry originally. Good God! Nicely balanced conflict of values. Cat CANNOT look at life in other terms than Vincent is not just her lover but her mission, her calling...? Vincent has had his fill of missions. Safety, normalcy is what he craves. Yet together they are lovers with a mission. Another theme about Cat is she is so headstrong, she is likely to make decisions for Vincent, without his being consulted. She was well aware of that danger in this episode and working hard to avoid it. So, that's more for the theme "we have grown through the trials of S2". I agree with alwayscrazedbatbfan that the two of them may still be tentative on what their union means. Finally, Season 2 began well and didn't begin to derail until episodes 7 or 8. I liked very much the moral conflict Cat was having over the "risk of Vincent's losing his humanity" - a reasonable worry considering his inner conflicts. That's why it was nice to revisit that conflict in this episode and see Vincent regain control (and avoid being shot by Cat). And I was willing to make allowances for Vincent being attracted to Tori, since she seemed to have the ability to amplify his powers and confuse his reasoning. He can't be held completely responsible. But by the time Catherine begins insisting she is "with Gabe", the rails have been left far behind. Mr. Kern had managed to completely erase everything that made S1 charming. I agree with @locaxbatb that the lesson has likely been learned. We certainly moaned and griped enough to be heard. That's Beastie Power! Remember all the critics who wanted BatB cancelled at the end of S2? One who is not to be named in particular... We will be heard. (I trust) Hello Bill the beast, so very nice to finally meet you! I was told by BeastieBoy that I would really appreciate meeting you and he underestimated the admiration! Your comments are so insightful and somewhat scarily what I have been thinking as I did my solo re-watches. I spookily had a somewhat similar conversation with myself while watching, as I often do. You evaluated the Tori-Vincent non-relationship very well. I love what your post details and I looked forward to delving deeper into Rebecca and Alistair because when they were introduced I grasped that they are linchpins in our saga. The journal is not merely window dressing, I do believe it holds valuable information. To me there is no unnecessary or redundant information in truly worthwhile epic storytelling. It only takes deeper listening and focus to see/hear what could be so easily missed if one allows themself to become distracted by what one could think is background noise. I truly do look forward to more of your insightful observations and comments as the season continues.
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Post by ArwenFan on Jun 12, 2015 22:27:47 GMT -5
This was a good episode. I really enjoyed it and can't really add much more to what's already been said. But I do want to mention my personal favorite things about BoWS.
I liked the energy of the scenes, there was lots of movement in all of the scenes and made the episode feel less insular. I hope this aspect continues throughout the season.
I'm delighted that Cat is still driving the Mustang.
I liked Cat's new hairstyle. And I've missed Vincat's dimples!!! The opening scene was wonderfully sexy as was the morning after. It's nice to see Vincat having normal moments before the other shoe dropped. I'm delighted that Vincent is practicing medicine again. He needs his own thing just like Cat has hers. And on a shallow note...he makes one hot doctor.
I liked Cat's and Tess's dueling phone calls at the police precinct. Tess appears to still be resisting the fact that "beasts" are a reality and it's her lot in life to be part of the madness. At least she was less grating about it than she's been in the past. Still can't say that I've signed on to the JT&T ship, but whatever.
I did like Vincent giving voice to his concerns and desires once he was made aware of the BoWS. I also liked how Catherine was conflicted and how she weighed Vincent's feelings and safety against everything the Feds threw at her. This episode handled the same themes ''Ever After" tried to deal with a 100 times better.
I thought KK did an amazing job showing Catherine's uncertainty and concern when confronting Vincent's anger and disbelief at the hospital, and later at the boat house when she interrupted his workout. I loved how Vincent went all-out beast after he was thrown over the side of the building, and beat the snot out of Tyler. Enraged-I-want-to-kill-something Vincent is sexy as hell.
I loved Heather's leaving town outfit and her wedding gown. She has good taste in wedding gowns and NGA is adorable. I liked the use of the character in the episode, a little bit not TOO much. I'm glad JT's pity party was brief. I have to agree with Tess in that I don't have any patience for whiny, mopey crybabies either.
Hope we're done hearing about Alistair and Rebecca. Really.
Vincent saving Agent Thomas's life in the ER was good stuff. Cat is right. His beast side is a gift and he uses it for good. And finally, the proposal was perfect. No cliched romantic dinner with roses and champagne for our Vincat. All of the important moments in this relationship must be marked on the rooftop.
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Post by ArwenFan on Jun 12, 2015 22:29:34 GMT -5
LOVE LOVE LOVE how Catherine was SECRETLY coveting the wedding dress in the store! I know! And she wasn't as smooth as she thought she was hiding it.
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Post by ArwenFan on Jun 12, 2015 23:08:00 GMT -5
BeastieBoy, you're right, this is a shame when such a great ep is ruined with too many spoilers! For me it wasn't because I saw it with only the ring promo clip, but I totally relate. I've decided not to read any spoiler here and not vizit 3x2 or next threads before I've seen the episode! And I intend to hold on that This is my 3rd year being spoiler free. I just love watching an episode with no expectations or preconceived notions. Join my little circle, padawans. It's all right.
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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Jun 13, 2015 0:27:56 GMT -5
I've been enjoying the thoughtful comments of alwayscrazedbatbfan But I have some observations. As a one-time New Yorker, I wanna say people don't hang out on the rooftops much, at any time of day. That's just poetic license. But at night? You've gotta be kidding. One of the BatB cliches has been the window and the fire-escape but, please! Any such real situations would have padlocked bars on the windows. And even so, it's a risk. The first time I saw a BatB episode and Vincent just came to the unlocked window, I had a heart attack! So Cat & Vincent have the rooftops entirely to themselves, most any time. Not a problem. Good to read comments by @locaxbatb again. It has been too long, my friend. We talked about the issue of spoilers on BatB and Heartland. I've come to this conclusion for myself: my advice, don't watch anything that could be a spoiler. I know that's hard when you're starved for it but I've seen it too many times with episodes that are borderline, you tip it one way or the other all by yourself. To those worried about the pace, remember we only have 10 episodes for S3, right? Have to make allowances. Can't tell everything from this one episode but we've seen enough to be puzzled, intrigued. The implication of what we've seen in 3.01 is that there is some secret organization(s) experimenting on people. Yet we saw that at the end of S2 and I thought they were defeated by Sam and VinCat. JT and Tess work well enough for me @dave It's the attraction of opposites. But at a deeper level they are fundamentally similar. The proposal was 99.9% for me. Only one quibble, and I'm being old fashioned here, when Vincent took a knee, he should say her full name. "Catherine (middle) Chandler, will you do me the honor .... etc." Just my opinion. I should be thrilled that he even took a knee at all since he was going to stick the ring in a strawberry originally. Good God! Nicely balanced conflict of values. Cat CANNOT look at life in other terms than Vincent is not just her lover but her mission, her calling...? Vincent has had his fill of missions. Safety, normalcy is what he craves. Yet together they are lovers with a mission. Another theme about Cat is she is so headstrong, she is likely to make decisions for Vincent, without his being consulted. She was well aware of that danger in this episode and working hard to avoid it. So, that's more for the theme "we have grown through the trials of S2". I agree with alwayscrazedbatbfan that the two of them may still be tentative on what their union means. Finally, Season 2 began well and didn't begin to derail until episodes 7 or 8. I liked very much the moral conflict Cat was having over the "risk of Vincent's losing his humanity" - a reasonable worry considering his inner conflicts. That's why it was nice to revisit that conflict in this episode and see Vincent regain control (and avoid being shot by Cat). And I was willing to make allowances for Vincent being attracted to Tori, since she seemed to have the ability to amplify his powers and confuse his reasoning. He can't be held completely responsible. But by the time Catherine begins insisting she is "with Gabe", the rails have been left far behind. Mr. Kern had managed to completely erase everything that made S1 charming. I agree with @locaxbatb that the lesson has likely been learned. We certainly moaned and griped enough to be heard. That's Beastie Power! Remember all the critics who wanted BatB cancelled at the end of S2? One who is not to be named in particular... We will be heard. (I trust) welcome back Bill we have 13 eps not 10, thank god
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Post by BeastieBoy on Jun 13, 2015 1:00:51 GMT -5
I've re-watched the episode off of the CW website and have had time to process my feelings. Left it to stream a few times on mute to help with on-line viewing numbers too. I feel I can now give a better assessment of the episode, it was an excellent episode in many ways. High points: - Opening roof top scene, was electrifying! I knew CA's tease about "ripping clothes off" wasn't going to happen. But I don't need VinCat naked in bed to get my motor running. IMHO, this scene was on par with any of the love scenes from AMP, especially with the morning after bed scene and cute breakfast scene. The music was a perfect match, the whole scene was perfect. - To book end the episode, the closing proposal scene was so sweet and perfect as well. No doubt a scene that can be watched countless times and will never get old. However, I do agree with Bill the beast, Vincent should have said "Catherine Chandler will you marry me?" instead of just "will you marry me?" I really loved that it was his mother's ring, so much emotion in the build up and the entire scene. - Overall the episode was very well balanced, with the right amount of romance, deep conversations and action. It also sets the stage and tone of the season very well, with each of the sub characters also having their own sub arcs it would seem. - I loved that the 2x17 "you are my gem" aspect of the story is playing out. Catherine is Vincent's gem, she is the only one that can control his Beast. I want it to stay that way. I'm very interested to see how the mythology plays out this season. I like Rebecca and Alistair. - The climatic battle scene was well done and the special effects were top notch. Low points: Well, really no low points, more like little gripes. - The repetitive dialogue gets even more repetitive upon re-watches. - The DHS guys were kind of blah, but I think agent Thomas was the better of the two. Perhaps that was by design, since he survived. Will have to see how he develops. - There wasn't enough suspense and real drama for me. Cat got shoved, but really wasn't that badly hurt and I knew Vincent would triumph over Tyler. - I missed not having an authority figure at the Precinct. Capt. Ward was nowhere to be seen and I still miss Joe. All in all, I'll grade it an A-. The opening and closing scenes alone would be an A+++ and make up for the other minor gripes I have with the episode. I'm very excited for the rest of the season now. No, there will never be another S1, the characters have come too far. But that doesn't mean S3 can't be great in its own right. And yes, I've learned my lesson, you won't see me in the Spoiler section any more.
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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Jun 13, 2015 1:47:59 GMT -5
I've re-watched the episode off of the CW website and have had time to process my feelings. Left it to stream a few times on mute to help with on-line viewing numbers too. I feel I can now give a better assessment of the episode, it was an excellent episode in many ways. High points: - Opening roof top scene, was electrifying! I knew CA's tease about "ripping clothes off" wasn't going to happen. But I don't need VinCat naked in bed to get my motor running. IMHO, this scene was on par with any of the love scenes from AMP, especially with the morning after bed scene and cute breakfast scene. The music was a perfect match, the whole scene was perfect. - To book end the episode, the closing proposal scene was so sweet and perfect as well. No doubt a scene that can be watched countless times and will never get old. However, I do agree with Bill the beast, Vincent should have said "Catherine Chandler will you marry me?" instead of just "will you marry me?" I really loved that it was his mother's ring, so much emotion in the build up and the entire scene. - Overall the episode was very well balanced, with the right amount of romance, deep conversations and action. It also sets the stage and tone of the season very well, with each of the sub characters also having their own sub arcs it would seem. - I loved that the 2x17 "you are my gem" aspect of the story is playing out. Catherine is Vincent's gem, she is the only one that can control his Beast. I want it to stay that way. I'm very interested to see how the mythology plays out this season. I like Rebecca and Alistair. - The climatic battle scene was well done and the special effects were top notch. Low points: Well, really no low points, more like little gripes. - The repetitive dialogue gets even more repetitive upon re-watches. - The DHS guys were kind of blah, but I think agent Thomas was the better of the two. Perhaps that was by design, since he survived. Will have to see how he develops. - There wasn't enough suspense and real drama for me. Cat got shoved, but really wasn't that badly hurt and I knew Vincent would triumph over Tyler. - I missed not having an authority figure at the Precinct. Capt. Ward was nowhere to be seen and I still miss Joe. All in all, I'll grade it an A-. The opening and closing scenes alone would be an A+++ and make up for the other minor gripes I have with the episode. I'm very excited for the rest of the season now. No, there will never be another S1, the characters have come too far. But that doesn't mean S3 can't be great in its own right. And yes, I've learned my lesson, you won't see me in the Spoiler section any more. do i remember well that u watched s1 after watching s2? what did u think about the two seasons comparatively?
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Post by BeastieBoy on Jun 13, 2015 2:55:10 GMT -5
anapi -season3baby :), I assume you mean how do I compare S2 & S1, since it's too early to say for S3. Yes, I am probably one of the very few that watched the seasons in the wrong order. I stumbled upon BATB really by chance flipping channels. I knew KK from Smallville, but never really followed her very closely after she left that series. I just happened to flip to the CW just as "Kidnapped" was starting, saw KK and decided to watch out of curiosity. I had missed "Who Am I" when it played live and went to the CW site later to watch it, so I pretty much saw of all of S2 live when it originally aired. Because Vincent had lost his memory, it was kind of a clean slate. So I didn't feel compelled to go back and quickly watch all of S1. I was learning about the characters just as Vincent was learning "who am I" and the love VinCat once had. I have given many comments on S2 on this SEO board in many places, so I won't repeat all of those details. But I enjoyed S2, for me it didn't suck. Probably because I had no S1 to compare it to at the time. The beast of the week arcs were fun, the triangles were kind of boring but didn't upset me, but the best was from 215-222. As you know, it was 217 that really hooked me into becoming a true beastie vs a normal viewer. I was enjoying S2 so much I wanted to save S1 for the long hiatus to S3. (I had no clue it would be this long!!!) Anyway, watching S1 was then like watching a movie prequel. Being a romantic and a KK fan, I think I loved S1 for exactly the same reasons that everyone else does. You only fall in love for the first time once and that was the essence of S1. Hence S1 will always be special because of that. But objectively, S1 was far from perfect. Like you, I felt some of the "case of the week" plots were kind of lame, but the VinCat romance made up for that. For me, the best part of S1 was 109-118. I'd even argue that 119-122 were somewhat S2-ish. For sure I'd take S1 over S2 any day, but S2 was still enjoyable for me.
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