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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Nov 25, 2013 1:35:29 GMT -5
This episode has turned me into a bit of a teary mess....Oh alright...maybe I'm doing a bit more of this thanks to being so tired: And you're welcome, though I may go pass out on a pillow now. LOL. Here: . You should go now and rest, Ashley! I'll stay. Don't worry . I'm here now too! I'm still
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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Nov 25, 2013 1:39:17 GMT -5
Hi People, after watching the episode twice ready to post my review. Firstly, I thought the episode was great and the last ten minutes were out of this world. I am very happy with the direction the writers are taking (I will explain why shortly) and I thoroughly enjoyed everyone’s’ performance – well J.T. and Tess had a minor role in this episode, but enjoyed the comic element they added to this episode, which let’s face it was pretty dark. I even really enjoyed Amber’s performance for the first time so well done to her, she is actually better than I thought she was.
I am thrilled with the way it ended (the last ten minutes) and this is why. I feel the way it ended both Vincent and Catherine are now on equal sort of grounds and they have hit rock bottom. It will now only get better from now on (though there will be more bumps on the way).
Vincent: In this episode you really feel for him and I am hoping he somewhat redeemed himself in people’s eyes, though I think he will fully redeem himself in episode 9 (my theory anyway). Poor Vincent – I mean, who could blame him for wanting to kill Reynolds? Is that even a beastly thing to want to do?? I am not saying doing it is fine, but I would also think about killing him in his place lol. The guy has destroyed his life completely – he was involved in Murfield from the start, he turned him into a beast, he then erased his memories, he broke him up from Catherine, he experimented more on him, he made him lose his humanity and kill beast people, he tried to kill him and I am sure he did other things as well but these are the key ones anyway. Even though he finds out the truth about Reynolds, and even though he has Tori (the pain in his bum) trying to get him to kill Reynolds, he is still unsure of what is right and really does listen to Catherine when she tells him not to do anything (she has such a calming effect on him, love that). He also puts up with former beast Gabe and does not lose his temper. Ok, in the end he beasts out and goes after Reynolds, but overall he was not beast. When the car crashes and he goes after Reynolds he does not check on Cat (interesting reminder of Bridesmaids it up when there was a car crash and he pulled her out) but to me that was ok, because clearly in my mind he knew she was absolutely fine. It has been proven in previous episodes that he can sense if she is well or not. When Catherine speaks to him in the last scene, he calms down momentarily but then beasts out again though we are not entirely sure if he would finish Reynolds since Catherine shoots him. The way he looked at Catherine when he realised she shot him was so heartbreaking – the only person he loves and trusts and relies on has actually betrayed him. That was such a sad moment. He then runs away in shock and disbelief…
Catherine: She also has had to deal with so much crap, hasn’t she? She finds out that her dad was what he was on top of all that she has had to deal with recently. And she really wants to be with Vincent desperately (you can see that) but she needs him to prove to her that he deserves it. And the way she feels that should be is by him not killing her dad. I do not think she is as interested in saving his life, as she is interested in Vincent proving to her he is not a beast (in terms of his intentions, morality and self-restraint) and what better way to prove it than by him not killing the person who ruined his life. When Catherine threatens Vincent with the gun, you can see the desperation in her eyes (well played KK!) – all she wants is for Vincent to prove to her he is no beast, she is still desperate for them to be together. When he beasts out again I think she automatically just shot him, I don’t even think it was a conscious, calculated decision, I think it was reflex and you could tell she was completely devastated by what she did, but she was also devastated by the fact that she thought Vincent would definitely kill Reynolds (after that one moment of pure relief when he had calmed down).
Tori: Oh man, don’t start me on her. What a beastly she-beast lol. I do want to give people and beasts the benefit of the doubt and I understand she is completely on her own, she is distressed, angry, she is a new beast etc. but she was something in this episode! Yes, you feel it makes sense to kill Reynolds (fair enough), and u killed the bomber (again fair enough) but why do you need to be a witch with Catherine as well and be so demanding and territorial of Vincent? You just met him lady! To me Tori is definitely attracted to Vincent (was clear in this episode) but confident it won’t go any further. But yes, she acted like a spoilt brat and I didn’t like her one bit
Gabe: so all our theories about his beast being dormant were bull lol , unless things take a turn for the worse in arc 2. In this episode Gabe really did help Catherine and clearly his motivation appears to be that he really wants to win her heart. What he does not know is that being a very good guy is not enough to win ones heart. Cat is weak at the moment and we could see how she warmed up to him and was comforted in his cuddles, but really Cat does not and will not love Gabe, like ever. So even if in a weak moment she kisses him (not even sure that will happen) she will not go any further with him. She will wonder, should I be with Gabe, he is a good guy, loves me etc and she will be tempted but she won’t go there, because she does NOT love him and never will. Now what happens when Gabe realises him and her are not destined lol, well that I do not know
Reynolds: Sympathised a bit more with him this episode, he was a bit less evil. At least the reasons for doing what he did were moral (in his mind of course). And he does care for Cat, but obviously he goes about it the wrong way. Anyway we do not have to worry about him much, I think he is gone now for a good while, wonder if they decide to bring him back at any point (could happen) though that won’t be any time soon. Shame in a way cause Ted is a darn good actor!
Tess and J.T. – lol these two are funny, J.T. was totally energised by that kiss lol and he is really going for it now Tess is resisting, but not for long - don’t know what u guys think but the one thing I really would not like to see lol is J.T. and Tess having sex -kiss yes, sex please don’t show us any of that!!!
What I loved about the episode: -Acting, everyone was very good. KK, Ted and Jay were great! Won’t even go into individual scenes to comment on the acting it was great throughout but some pivotal ones were the last one between Cat and Vincent, the coffee shop one between her and her dad, the prison one between her and her dad. - Very engaging, could not believe how quickly 42 minutes went by, I felt I had been watching for 10 -Action wise was great -Character portrayal was great -Loved that they explained Tori’s role, to me she is not just a plot device, served a good purpose and (as I explain later in my predictions about arc 2 she will serve an even better one in episode 9). -Pace was great and loved the intensity -Solid writing -Loved how Vincent kicked Reynold’s bum in the last fight (ted said he still has bruises lol) -the emotions it evoked - The J.T. and Tess interactions -no major plot holes - the way it ended, and the whole last 7-8 minutes - the last song choice -the scenes between daddy Reynolds and Cat - Loved to hate Tori as well
What I hated about the episode: Nothing lol, sorry! I did not even mind the Gabe-Cat thing. These two wont be a couple, though I would not be at all surprised if Cat does briefly consider it.
I think this is how the next arc will develop. In episode 9 Vincent will choose man (not beast) and he will also reject Tory. Tory is sexually attracted to Vincent (was evident to me in this episode, though not the other way round). Vincent has a somewhat animal type of attraction to Tori (kiss served the purpose of showing this to us). Yet in episode 9 Vincent will reject Tori and embrace his humanity (more than his beast side). But at the same time he will not try to get together with Catherine, because he will feel betrayed and he will not trust her. Catherine will not know he is man, not beast and she will also not try to get together with him. And the way the writers have played it I think that the viewers will find both characters likeable/relatable, understand their actions but also knowing how things are longing for them to fall in love again and be together again. And this will be the focus of arc 2 with them both bumping into each other, quite a few misunderstandings happening but (exactly as per season 1) falling in love with each other again and realising they are destined and cannot live without each other. Regarding other romances, obviously now Cat is distressed and Gabe is offering a helping hand plus he does love her it seems so she will be tempted, but besides maybe a kiss or two they will not go there. And other love interests? I now do not think there will be any. I think that was it, the rest of the season is them two finding each other again. It will be sexy, funny and very romantic. The epic love will be back!
Oh and to end I will leave you with the lyrics of the end song which I loved and thought was so appropriate. Vincent and Catherine love each other but things are so hard for them and they in a way want to let go, but then really they do not and cannot let go. Their love may be very painful, but it is also true, it is real. I will quote somebody else’s interpretation of this song which to me sums up Vincat
Quoting: “This song is beautifully tragic. I think that in general, it's about a couple that wants to move on from one another at times because it gets so hard, but can never truly let go of their feelings. Love is painful, but it's real.
This song is all about balance, you can't have the good without the bad. Music is art, and art is all in the eye of the beholder. This is just my perception.
You only know what I want you to I know everything you don't want me to
*He tries to hide his mistakes & demons, but she sees right through it, and knows who he truly is...yet she loves and accepts him anyways.
Oh your mouth is poison, your mouth is wine You think your dreams are the same as mine
*A kiss is dangerous because it can always help them reconnect. In rough times, it's good like wine but destructive like poison. They have much in common, which can be good and bad.
Oh I don't love you but I always will Oh I don't love you but I always will Oh I don't love you but I always will I always will
*This is what I mentioned from the beginning, they don't always want to be together or love one another because of the pain it causes. Yet they always end up back together because it's a spot nobody else can fill.
I wish you'd hold me when I turn my back The less I give the more I get back
*When one pulls away, they secretly want to be pulled back in, and sometimes that's why they have to pull away - to feel important again.
Oh your hands can heal, your hands can bruise I don't have a choice but I'd still choose you
*The hand that pushes you down will be the same hand to get you back up on your feet again. We don't get to choose who we love, but we like to believe it would be the same if we could.
Oh I don't love you but I always will Oh I don't love you but I always will Oh I don't love you but I always will Oh I don't love you but I always will Oh I don't love you but I always will Oh I don't love you but I always will Oh I don't love you but I always will
I always will I always will I always will I always will “
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Post by Catherine Chandler on Nov 25, 2013 1:40:45 GMT -5
Here: . You should go now and rest, Ashley! I'll stay. Don't worry . I'm here now too! I'm still Oh, see! Yolie is going to stay too . And just like me, she doesn't sleep either
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Nov 25, 2013 1:48:14 GMT -5
I'm here now too! I'm still Oh, see! Yolie is going to stay too . And just like me, she doesn't sleep either What's sleep?? Yes I'm here ALL night into the dawn of day If I'm quiet I'm gathering my thoughts about this episode. Oh and making my roof notes, if I recall I have a challenge to beat! LOL
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Post by beastiegirl.happy.puppy on Nov 25, 2013 1:48:44 GMT -5
This episode lived up to my expectations!! It was everything BatB was meant to be. The performances were great. There wasn't a weak link in the bunch. Top marks go to Kristin, Jay & Ted. All gave powerful, believable & heart wrenching performances. It's sad that each character, by doing what they felt was right, ended up making a decision that had the potential to destroy not only their lives but also those of the ones they love.
I couldn't help but feel sorry for those that won't be watching this magnificent episode because they were so upset over the Vincent/Tori connection introduced last week! When something is revealed in stages or pieces, it is very easy to perceive it to be quite different than what it actually is.
I will be re-watching 208 at least twice this week as I'm sure than there are things I didn't pick up on tonight. During the hiatus, I'll be re-watching S02 so I can see the storyline build. Although I don't necessarily like everything I see, I do like this season. To me it shows that the writers has a clear outline of how they plan to tell their version of BatB. Just because we can't quite see the emerging pattern doesn't mean it's not there.
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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Nov 25, 2013 2:01:15 GMT -5
This episode lived up Although I don't necessarily like everything I see, I do like this season. To me it shows that the writers has a clear outline of how they plan to tell their version of BatB. Just because we can't quite see the emerging pattern doesn't mean it's not there. I completely agree with your post and especially the above. this became very clear to me in the last episode hence one of the reasons I really liked it and i also loved this episode too
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Post by curly on Nov 25, 2013 2:19:03 GMT -5
One of the better episodes yet. I like the pace and seemed to have a good flow and editing. Again its sad that it has taken 8 episodes to move this along but I'm glad that it's not all happening in blink of a eye as a result. Is Daddy gone after this ep? or should we assume Cat will have to at least see her in jail for info. I feel like Tori acts and talks like a 16yr old. It would be really off putting to have them together romantically IMO. I'm not so sure they will go there with them. She'e too volatile and thats not good. I really don't feel it unless of course something happens next episode. I think she will be a thorn in Vincats side. and put them on opposing sides for a while thus the Mrs.and Mrs. Smith reference. I can live with all this. Is episode 9 a continuation of 8? What disturbs me - Okay did Cat really say "I can't let you do that" and "risk losing you in the process" to Gabe"? Ugh, they are so going there. Was this the "true feelings" revealed and also by Gabe admitting to wanting to save Vincent for her, I guess. Not a fan but I guess she needs someone to lean on who is there and she can count on. Can't hate on the sentiment but don't like the recipient. I have trouble digesting that setup today. My biggest issue is - So thats it, no more memories? ?? from ep 8 on? Feel cheated!!! Really feel we should get some of that back but I guess without them and a gunshot wound by your soul mate will cause a rift? LOL It's sad to think that that Vincent (1.0) is gone big time especially when he chose to go after Bob. He is suppose to have more control than that. Not really fond of Vincet 2.0 right now and see it has a total rewrite but I get why. I hate to admit it but this is the first time I am looking forward to seeing the next episode to see how everything plays out and the 1st time a may re watch and episode this season. Eeeeek! Sorry, sad but true. LOL And Im a fan!
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Post by SpydancerLovesVincat on Nov 25, 2013 2:23:44 GMT -5
I don't know what to say… More than anything else, I guess I'm just tired. It's just the wrong choice of direction for the storyline for this point in the season. Nothing to hold out hope for, nothing to hold onto, nothing to look forward to. It's all kind of a big disappointment. I'm just not feeling it. I don't know why Vincent even deserves to live at this point. Besides that, where is the character that we fell in love with? And Tori? Why doesn't somebody just kill her? She is so obviously a loose cannon. Hate is a strong word, but I pretty much hate everything about this choice of a storyline. It is like watching the ruins of the show, and I guess, I see how some might feel it is dramatic. I'm just sorry that they went there to begin with. It's just too much. The Tori character seems to have brought with her the beginning of what has left a very bad taste in my mouth. I can remember what it was that I loved about this show, I just don't see any of it anymore. Oh, well except JT and Tess in the morgue. They were pretty awesome.
Just to be clear, I know this is a fan site, and I'm certainly not trying to diss the show, I'm just pointing out that I can't stand anything about this storyline. It feels so far past the point of no return, I just can't. But it is nice that there was no beast on beast sex. At least there is that. And Gabe, puny little man that he is, seems to have earned the privilege of giving Catherine a hug. Besides annoyed, I just wish I FELT something. I don't recognize Vincent, so how can I feel sorry for him? I don't know, I just can't. Where did my favorite show go? Is it still the same show? I feel nothing, literally.
Catherine, by the way, God bless her, was all kinds of awesome. Kudos to KK.
I can see that others are pleased though, so I will try to keep my apathy and overall disappointment out of this thread. I'm just posting my initial feelings. I won't rant and rave like last week.
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Post by pippin on Nov 25, 2013 2:34:36 GMT -5
Some questions about the episode - 1)at the beginning Cat and Gabe are driving from Montauk and he tells Tess that they will see her in an hour. It is night and raining but when the arrive at Tori's it is daytime. How long did the gang hang out at Bob's place after the dinner fiasco?
2) How come Tori and Vincent were able to be around each other so much this episode without beasting out every second?
3) Why couldn't Tess have been with Cat listening in on the Bob / Gabe conversation and shouldn't she have been there for backup during the arrest?
4) Shouldn't Cat have handcuffed Bob when she arrested him the first time.
5) What is Bob going to confess to exactly without mentioning beasts?
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Post by SpydancerLovesVincat on Nov 25, 2013 2:44:00 GMT -5
the other thing i wanted to say is i think this is rock bottom and it will get better from now on. my feeling is that (we dont know for sure) vincent will choose man, not beast (and that is when he waves bye bye to she-beast tori) but obviously even thogh he chooses man cat does not know it yet, plus he does not trust her either. second arc is falling in love again, bumping into each other and realising slowly but surely that they are meant to be ..so i do think this was the lowerst point (though there may be a few other bumpy bits) and it will get better from here on But why wasn't his lowest point like 3 episodes ago? Or when he shoved Catherine in 2x02? How much is too much? Aren't we about five or six episodes past the point of no return? I guess I'm not sure why it is okay for him to be traipsing around with Tori choosing beast over humanity at this point… Tori was nowhere to be found when he was beating Reynolds to death, and there was Catherine… If this wasn't his judgement day, I don't know what would be… he's so far past the point of what is reparable in my opinion, and seemingly he has chosen his beast side, and Tori over Catherine (even if not in the "romantic" sense). None of it feels epic. We are way past what feels like the end of the road for Vincent. I understand the validity of the journey into darkness, but the writers have taken it so far past the point of no return, it just feels like character assassination to me. It begs the question, how much is too much? I think seeing him rip Tori's dad's heart out was more than enough of a descent into darkness… (combined with other things that happened earlier in the season), but then they keep pushing it farther and farther and more and more. It is like an overdose. Too too much.
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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Nov 25, 2013 2:57:28 GMT -5
the other thing i wanted to say is i think this is rock bottom and it will get better from now on. my feeling is that (we dont know for sure) vincent will choose man, not beast (and that is when he waves bye bye to she-beast tori) but obviously even thogh he chooses man cat does not know it yet, plus he does not trust her either. second arc is falling in love again, bumping into each other and realising slowly but surely that they are meant to be ..so i do think this was the lowerst point (though there may be a few other bumpy bits) and it will get better from here on But why wasn't his lowest point like 3 episodes ago? Or when he shoved Catherine in 2x02? How much is too much? Aren't we about five or six episodes past the point of no return? I guess I'm not sure why it is okay for him to be traipsing around with Tori choosing beast over humanity at this point… Tori was nowhere to be found when he was beating Reynolds to death, and there was Catherine… If this wasn't his judgement day, I don't know what would be… he's so far past the point of what is reparable in my opinion, and seemingly he has chosen his beast side, and Tori over Catherine (even if not in the "romantic" sense). None of it feels epic. We are way past what feels like the end of the road for Vincent. I understand the validity of the journey into darkness, but the writers have taken it so far past the point of no return, it just feels like character assassination to me. It begs the question, how much is too much? I think seeing him rip Tori's dad's heart out was more than enough of a descent into darkness… (combined with other things that happened earlier in the season), but then they keep pushing it farther and farther and more and more. It is like an overdose. Too too much. see i dont feel like that at all, i completely sympathise wth vincent and what he has and is continuing to go through for the reasons i mentioned above and in previous posts. I can sympathise with both cat and vincent and do not think at all he or their relationship is irreparable. in this episode i did not even see him choose tori, tori was just somebody who heightened his beastly senses. but he did not choose her - while cat calmed him down she fueled his anger. I don't know, for the things he has been through i thought he has handled himself well especially in this episode. and we do not even know if he would have ended up killing reynolds in that last scene. but i can completely understand how u are disappointed and cannot see a brighter future if u have these feelings about a main character, i iwould feel the same about the show as u, if i felt that about vincent.
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Nov 25, 2013 3:07:22 GMT -5
OKay is there a doctor in the house?? LOL
Actually someone with medical background...
Vincent was bleeding really bad..Is the bullet wound life threatening?? Anyone know?? LOL
I know the ONE person who can answer that for me isn't to happy with the episode right now BUT I'm curious
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Post by Catherine Chandler on Nov 25, 2013 3:13:46 GMT -5
Just to be clear, I know this is a fan site, and I'm certainly not trying to diss the show, I'm just pointing out that I can't stand anything about this storyline. It feels so far past the point of no return, I just can't. We never said that you shouldn't share your feelings. Like we mentioned before you can say that you didn't like the episode. I understand we're not same and obviously we don't like the same things. Like I didn't like the last episode but some did. I LOVE this episode but you don't. The problem was and I'm not saying it was you because it wasn't you but there are some posts on the board about the last episode saying the same thing over and over again about not watching the show because the person hated it. We get that you can post one or 2 times that you will not longer watch it because it's not the show you fell in love with anymore but to post the same thing like 10 times or more and not even in a nice way? And some them were kind of saying that we should all see why the show is not worth it anymore. If fans hate it, that's fine but don't try to make other fans hate the show if they love it. So don't feel bad about posting your feelings . I'm sorry KK is my weak point when it comes to this show!
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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Nov 25, 2013 3:17:53 GMT -5
OKay is there a doctor in the house?? LOL Actually someone with medical background... Vincent was bleeding really bad..Is the bullet wound life threatening?? Anyone know?? LOL I know the ONE person who can answer that for me isn't to happy with the episode right now BUT I'm curious s could it be vincent on please dont die on me
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Nov 25, 2013 3:21:37 GMT -5
OKay is there a doctor in the house?? LOL Actually someone with medical background... Vincent was bleeding really bad..Is the bullet wound life threatening?? Anyone know?? LOL I know the ONE person who can answer that for me isn't to happy with the episode right now BUT I'm curious s could it be vincent on please dont die on me I'm just asking a simple question since I have no medical background LOL
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