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Post by Chymere on Jul 13, 2015 12:52:02 GMT -5
Won't bore you with repeating what other people have already said - although that's the the kind of "repetition" I don't mind Great episode, and kudos to Kristin. She knocked it out of the ball park. What she said Ditto with all the unanimous comments! Really great episode We moved forward yeaaaaah thanks GOD! Now I expect the rest of the season with a plot going Crescendo, in the same vien of this one with just a little more of VinCat if possible but I have to say 3.06 passed so quickly, I have not had time to get bored so I am really happy with this one!
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Post by NotOnTv on Jul 13, 2015 13:03:03 GMT -5
For the sake of sounding like a broken record - what a fantastic episode!
Surely ranks up there with my favorites out of the entire three seasons.
KK clearly is not and never will be an ugly crier. Praise the Lord. She was so serene in those emotional scenes I don't know how the girl just turns it on and off like that. I am pretty sure there was a dozen different emotions behind her eyes in less than a nanosecond. That was some great acting. Apart from the waterworks scenes, I am really warming up to Tess/Catherine scene these days. I believe Cat brings out Tess' softer side and their chemistry is at its finest when they banter and tease each other or when Tess pulls the sarcasm. I think this is what the writers should go with. Rather than the cliche rank conflicts. I think Nina and Kristin have a wonderful chemistry precisely because they are so different but they do play off each other nicely when the script lets them go a little.
I didn't feel Vincent's cousins at all but maybe I wasn't supposed to. So I don't dwell on it. I didn't feel Jay's acting this episode either but he's entitled to a lazy acting now and then, I am sure he is going to make up for it in the episodes to come. Frankly, I am happy the focus was off Vincent this episode a bit and the writers let Catherine steal the spotlight for once. And I am ecstatic this was bout her issues for once that weren't directly related to chasing Vincent's ghosts so to say (they served only as an excuse).
I feel sorry for Nicole Anderson this season. Not much material to work with. Why they didn't make her a guest star is beyond me.
Loved the church scene in the end. Again, was expecting a tiny bit more emotion coming from Vincent but that went along with what I previously said about Ryan's acting this episode - he gets a free pass this time. Kristin more than made up for it - give the woman a good material she knocks it right out of the park. If there were a tree bark at the recieving end of those looks I swear they'd have chemistry. There are only very few actresses out there who can pull it off and none of them is on CW network. I wish she'd get the recognition she deserves. At least from her own network. Oh well.
I said a week ago that I trust these writers and they proved me right.
Also big wigs, give Jill Carter more episodes. She nailed it.
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Post by anapi -season3baby :) on Jul 13, 2015 13:22:15 GMT -5
For the sake of sounding like a broken record - what a fantastic episode! Surely ranks up there with my favorites out of the entire three seasons. KK clearly is not and never will be an ugly crier. Praise the Lord. She was so serene in those emotional scenes I don't know how the girl just turns it on and off like that. I am pretty sure there was a dozen different emotions behind her eyes in less than a nanosecond. That was some great acting. Apart from the waterworks scenes, I am really warming up to Tess/Catherine scene these days. I believe Cat brings out Tess' softer side and their chemistry is at its finest when they banter and tease each other or when Tess pulls the sarcasm. I think this is what the writers should go with. Rather than the cliche rank conflicts. I think Nina and Kristin have a wonderful chemistry precisely because they are so different but they do play off each other nicely when the script lets them go a little. I didn't feel Vincent's cousins at all but maybe I wasn't supposed to. So I don't dwell on it. I didn't feel Jay's acting this episode either but he's entitled to a lazy acting now and then, I am sure he is going to make up for it in the episodes to come. Frankly, I am happy the focus was off Vincent this episode a bit and the writers let Catherine steal the spotlight for once. And I am ecstatic this was bout her issues for once that weren't directly related to chasing Vincent's ghosts so to say (they served only as an excuse). I feel sorry for Nicole Anderson this season. Not much material to work with. Why they didn't make her a guest star is beyond me. Loved the church scene in the end. Again, was expecting a tiny bit more emotion coming from Vincent but that went along with what I previously said about Ryan's acting this episode - he gets a free pass this time. Kristin more than made up for it - give the woman a good material she knocks it right out of the park. If there were a tree bark at the recieving end of those looks I swear they'd have chemistry. There are only very few actresses out there who can pull it off and none of them is on CW network. I wish she'd get the recognition she deserves. At least from her own network. Oh well. I said a week ago that I trust these writers and they proved me right. Also big wigs, give Jill Carter more episodes. She nailed it. I agree about Nicole - they have not given her enough of a story yet at all - they did not have her as a guest star cause they wanted to keep her from doing other projects, like she did in season 2.regarding Jay, his acting did not feel off to me, but my focus was on KK and her scenes, this was 100% a cat centric episode. not sure there was much room in these scenes for vincent to be more emotional - but will be able to judge this better when i rewatch, as i said i was so drawn by cat's scenes and KK's acting in 306, so i think in a way it was kind of purposeful. i still dont trust the writers lol - but i trust gillian horvath and have for a while now - i knew she was a sensitive soul just by reading her tweets and her song choices...for me so far there was one good episode this season with a great end scene (301) and a Great episode (in its entirety), 306. and then a few fun episodes like 305 and 304. this episode does make me very hopeful in terms of the introduction of a proper big threat that will create lots of angsty and dangerous moments for vincat which will in turn result in some really memorable scenes, which I do not feel we have seen any of yet (besides the proposal) - but then again, there are many different writers with completely different approaches, understanding of vincat and what works so i would not bet money on it
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Post by alwayscrazedbatbfan on Jul 13, 2015 13:50:16 GMT -5
I don't think Vanessa was deliberately trying to make Cat her favorite daughter. I loved the way Cat described her relationship with her Mom back in Season 1's "Anniversary." She said that she was "always Mom's person," her little shadow, so to speak. She said that whenever it was asked who wanted to go to the store with Mom, Cat would always go. They would always be on the same side of every argument. Heather was the "daddy's girl," which just sometimes happens in families. No one seemed to see it as a negative, and you see from how torn up Heather still is over her mother's death in "Anniversary" that she obviously felt close to Vanessa as well. Cat just seems known to the family as the one most like Vanessa.
In 221 when Heather talks about not knowing where certain attributes of hers (actually some of the negative ones) came from, Cat says, "that would be from Mom." So I got the feeling then and there that Cat still was resentful the way her mother held back so much from her. Plus, Season 2 gave Cat a WHOLE OTHER set of reasons to be mad at her Mom in never telling her about her real biological father. Cat even thought she "didn't know who she was" as a result of still yet another one of her mother's secrets and this whole new half of her DNA.
So the secrets having piled up in Season 2 on top of seeinge everything Vincent went through as a result of thoes connected to her through DNA (Vincent said as much in 211's "Held Hostage" when he said he didn't know who to trust as anyone with Cat's DNA had screwed him over) have made Cat not know who her mother was and even to question her own memories. So this episode helps FINALLY provide some closure for Cat (and probably Vincent as well).
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Post by Suzieq ❤️ Beastie on Jul 13, 2015 14:00:40 GMT -5
I don't think Vanessa was deliberately trying to make Cat her favorite daughter. I loved the way Cat described her relationship with her Mom back in Season 1's "Anniversary." She said that she was "always Mom's person," her little shadow, so to speak. She said that whenever it was asked who wanted to go to the store with Mom, Cat would always go. They would always be on the same side of every argument. Heather was the "daddy's girl," which just sometimes happens in families. No one seemed to see it as a negative, and you see from how torn up Heather still is over her mother's death in "Anniversary" that she obviously felt close to Vanessa as well. Cat just seems known to the family as the one most like Vanessa. In 221 when Heather talks about not knowing where certain attributes of hers (actually some of the negative ones) came from, Cat says, "that would be from Mom." So I got the feeling then and there that Cat still was resentful the way her mother held back so much from her. Plus, Season 2 gave Cat a WHOLE OTHER set of reasons to be mad at her Mom in never telling her about her real biological father. Cat even thought she "didn't know who she was" as a result of still yet another one of her mother's secrets and this whole new half of her DNA. So the secrets having piled up in Season 2 on top of seeinge everything Vincent went through as a result of thoes connected to her through DNA (Vincent said as much in 211's "Held Hostage" when he said he didn't know who to trust as anyone with Cat's DNA had screwed him over) have made Cat not know who her mother was and even to question her own memories. So this episode helps FINALLY provide some closure for Cat (and probably Vincent as well). Haven't seen the episode yet, but I am so glad you reminded me of those past scenes with Cat and the memories/mentions of her mother. I hope this episode brings everything about Vanessa to light. I mean some of the whys and hows. Does Cat understand her mother more from the tape? Do we? Does Cat "forgive" her Mother for not telling her about her real father? Does the tape just give us a bit of information and we may get more later? Will we see Bob again? The little clip of him is never enough for me.....I love Ted, I want to see more of him. AND .....I am still wondering who killed Thomas Chandler? I just skimmed the comments..........I wanted to just keep some things a surprise so if these questions were already answered I'll wait till I see the episode. If not......do you think there will be more revealed about Vanessa or is that it about Cat's background?
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Post by alwayscrazedbatbfan on Jul 13, 2015 14:01:13 GMT -5
I know there is only so much they can do with Ted with him being behind bars, but I really wish there could be more Cat/Ted scenes just because they DO interact so well together.
You saw their amazing chemistry (but then the words "amazing chemistry" seem to go hand in hand with anyone KK works with) in Smallville Season 8 when KK's Lana went to Ted's character to get him to teach her how to fight so she could keep Lex and his goons at bay permanently. And his character seemed to almost torture her in order to get her to learn how to resist pain, and they built that almost father/daughter style relationship there (with the anger/resentment things as well, do to all she had to go through). So you could see there how they could almost just resume the rapport and relationship built there!
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Post by alwayscrazedbatbfan on Jul 13, 2015 14:18:08 GMT -5
Season 4 Suzie,
I have ALWAYS wondered who actually killed Thomas Chandler. I think we are supposed to assume it was Muirfield, BUT the last thing on Thomas' ipad screen and what he was going to show Catherine WAS about Bob Reynolds, as we learned from Tess and her tech guy. So I have always wondered a bit if Bob could have had anything to do with Thomas' death in order for his daughter NOT to learn about him. He would certainly never admit to it, if he DID have something to do with it.
However, Muirfield could have learned that Thomas was researching Bob or had been emailed/seen that Bob was returning to the country, and Muirfield chosen to kill Thomas then because he might expose Bob. So there are MULTIPLE suspects with reasons to want Thomas dead at that time, as he was on his way to tell Cat about Bob.
And WHY did Thomas feel the need to tell Cat about Bob just then? I still feel there are many unanswered questions that I hope get addressed.
And I haven't seen the episode yet (OH PLEASE COME FASTER THURSDAY), so others will have to correct me if I am wrong. BUT I am assuming the tape explains to Catherine the theory I have always had about Vanessa---she got involved in Muirfield originally thinking that their experiments were meant to improve people for the betterment of mankind. Vanessa tells Vincent this in the flashback that he had of her. She also told him that she "does this for her daughters." She really believed in trying to help the soldiers be better fighters AND that they could get ahold of the side-effects without it turning out like it did.
I always felt Vanessa REMAINED with Muirfield due to inwardly subverting their efforts and trying to help the potential victims without Muirfield's knowledge. After all, Gabe AND Bob credit Vanessa with "getting the kids out" of the orphanage and away from the experiments, even having some declared dead, so that they couldn't be harmed anymore. So she stayed on the inside in order to lessen the evil. Because if she had just walked away, others would have continued without having the scruples she had.
So I think the videotape is Vanessa trying to explain why she simply didn't leave Muirfield after she learned the truth---she wanted to try to lessen or prevent the damage they were doing. And you can only do that from the inside.
But Vanessa knows her daughter well, and she probably realized that Cat WOULD learn the truth someday and might either hate or question her about it. And she knew Muirfield was going to kill her in the end after she had threatened to expose them if they killed all the soldiers from the experiment rather than trying to contain them and help them. So she wanted Cat to know WHY she did what she did.
Since meeting Vincent, Cat has always wondered whether or not her mother was a "good person" or not, as she herself told Vincent. So she finally gets reason and rationale behind what her mother did.
And in some way, Cat is still just like her mother. Cat has to face these same type of emotional dilemmas/gray areas in what she does alongside Vincent. She can't tell the world the truth about those "exposed" to the serum, yet she tries to track the individuals down and prevent worse damage AND get them the help where possible. So she CHOOSES to not turn a blind eye to the experiments and to become involved, even though she often has to cross lines to do it and constantly question her morality. We saw this ESPECIALLY in Season 2 when Vincent was going over the edge, and Cat had to decide how to handle each situation as it comes up. Even after she shot him, she was covering for him being there when her father was arrested. Again, that was withholding the truth from the feds, but she was trying to act in accordance with what she felt was right, same as her mother did.
And it DOES make you think--Cat will probably need to leave a similar videotape for HER daughter someday, in case she is killed while pursuing these experiments. Because her child will wonder about all the secrets her parents kept from her. Even though there were reasons behind it. After all, how many posts have WE all made, questioning Cat's OR Vincent's actions, depending on the circumstances and trauma going on at the time! That Morality Line is having to be re-drawn and re-questioned all the time for both Catherine and Vincent.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2015 15:10:23 GMT -5
What can I say.... I have watched thw episode twice in a day (one with subtitle just to be sure to understand) plus obviusly some random important scene... I love it and I feel it is quite a complete episode. In fact Vincent hasn't got a big part in this episode so possibly Jay doesn't have the chance to play his best but I feel both how awkward he felt at his bachelor party (fake smile on his face) and mixed disappointed with his cousin Hank and free to have finally understand that his real family i made of JT Tess Cat and possibly Heather even if she wasn't there. Jay has a big episode last week, now is the time for KK to express all her potential and she surely did very well. There is one thing I didn't understand at this point: JT has lost his superpower? Why he hasn't talk with Vincent about his protobeast DNA before? And what about Heather... well Heather is Heather she is the normalcy that probably Cat will never have! But she is not selfish as she appear in S1 and S2 so I give my 2 cents that she will have at least one episode with a wider part. And last but not least we saw the big bad! Wow I can't wait to see who/what he is... because he isn't the one I was expected
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Jul 13, 2015 15:16:33 GMT -5
What can I say.... I have watched thw episode twice in a day (one with subtitle just to be sure to understand) plus obviusly some random important scene... I love it and I feel it is quite a complete episode. In fact Vincent hasn't got a big part in this episode so possnoibly Jay doesn't have the chance to play his best but I feel both how awkward he felt at his bachelor party (fake smile on his face) and mixed disappointed with his cousin Hank and free to have finally understand that his real family i made of JT Tess Cat and possibly Heather even if she wasn't there. Jay has a big episode last week, now is the time for KK to express all her potential and she surely did very well. There is one thing I didn't understand at this point: JT has lost his superpower? Why he hasn't talk with Vincent about his protobeast DNA before? And what about Heather... well Heather is Heather she is the normalcy that probably Cat will never have! But she is not selfish as she appear in S1 and S2 so I give my 2 cents that she will have at least one episode with a wider part. And last but not least we saw the big bad! Wow I can't wait to see who/what he is... because he isn't the one I was expected He's just an enhanced assassin like Bob and Carol were. The big bad better be real bad that's all I'm saying lol ...so much hype and mystery this better be good
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Post by Ilaria on Jul 13, 2015 15:44:41 GMT -5
This is a fairly complete episode with some small and short fun time but especially so many mixed feelings that bring to light the ghosts of the past. Cat and her mother, I had no idea that Cat was angry with her so much, I thought she had solved the anger towards her for what she had done to Vincent, but obviously it was not. Vincent doesn't know how to approach his parents, but he doesn't want to pass up the single point of contact with the past. I think from now on will be the real rollercoaster
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Post by VinCat❤Destined on Jul 13, 2015 19:00:23 GMT -5
I thought I'd show you without really spoiling it the emotions that KK displayed during certain scenes. These scenes in itself VERY powerful! The thing was that in a certain scene it was ONLY her expressions that told her story and what she was feeling. I haven't cried like this for an episode in a while! She made me FEEL EVERYTHING! Nothing too spoilerish JUST Catherine's reactions For Suzieq ❤️ BeastieA few photos: Shower scene : Emotional mother's scene: This moment was a significant reveal
With Heather: At church waiting for Vincent:
I saw this as she was FINALLY at peace with her mom. Her heavy heart lifted! Expressing to Vincent how she felt Vincent comfort and support ( reminded me of Heart Of Darkness subway scene)I can't express enough, everything @clena said, anapi -season3baby :) and all the others said about this episode is so TRUE!! Although I will say that Vincent was just a support for her in this episode. This was ALL about Catherine! Refreshing episode and beautifully directed and written. Kudos to KK for her tremendous performance! I edited this post to say one thing, I am ONE who is enjoying this season. I understand why say that there was something missing even though the show was better. I always understood where they were coming from. When you get an episode like this, EVERYTHING goes out the window and you can truly appreciate what we fell in love when it comes to this show. I needed emotions, I needed true angst, I needed to FEEL the characters and this episode did just that!
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Post by Suzieq ❤️ Beastie on Jul 13, 2015 19:53:42 GMT -5
I thought I'd show you without really spoiling it the emotions that KK displayed during certain scenes. These scenes in itself VERY powerful! The thing was that in a certain scene it was ONLY her expressions that told her story and what she was feeling. I haven't cried like this for an episode in a while! She made me FEEL EVERYTHING! Nothing too spoilerish JUST Catherine's reactions For Suzieq ❤️ BeastieA few photos: Shower scene : Emotional mother's scene: This moment was a significant reveal
With Heather: At church waiting for Vincent:
I saw this as she was FINALLY at peace with her mom. Her heavy heart lifted! Expressing to Vincent how she felt Vincent comfort and support ( reminded me of Heart Of Darkness subway scene)I can't express enough, everything @clena said, anapi -season3baby :) and all the others said about this episode is so TRUE!! Although I will say that Vincent was just a support for her in this episode. This was ALL about Catherine! Refreshing episode and beautifully directed and written. Kudos to KK for her tremendous performance! I edited this post to say one thing, I am ONE who is enjoying this season. I understand why say that there was something missing even though the show was better. I always understood where they were coming from. When you get an episode like this, EVERYTHING goes out the window and you can truly appreciate what we fell in love when it comes to this show. I needed emotions, I needed true angst, I needed to FEEL the characters and this episode did just that! OH MY GOODNESS,........You are such a sweet ANGEL, Yolie! XOXOXOXO Thank you so much for these screen caps. I've been looking at these for 15 minutes now. I think I am going to love these scenes. Can't wait! VinCat❤Destined
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Post by ArwenFan on Jul 13, 2015 20:30:29 GMT -5
Too bad Aaron couldn't be there. He's overseas:( he's definitely got the Keller blood of wanting to help. Would love a reunion with him one day. Aaron is more family then the goon cousin. And I've never been to crazy about loclyn. (Hank) I'm glad they explained Aaron's absence rather than just bring in a bunch of new faces and pretend he never existed.
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Post by ArwenFan on Jul 13, 2015 20:32:08 GMT -5
i really dont think they will they will try but i think the proper wedding will be private - has to be! Yes!! Has to be!! This ep just proved that VinCat are uncomfortable around strangers, including relatives! I have no expectations for the wedding, I'm just hoping it will be lovely and strictly Vincat.
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Post by ArwenFan on Jul 13, 2015 20:35:28 GMT -5
Mocha, My theory has always been that Catherine had something extra special in her DNA as well, hence another reason why Vanessa was so into genetic research---she, too, might have known about Rebecca and Alistair and more to that whole gem thing (and the possibility of beast-taming inherited traits, or something to that effect). So if Catherine's DNA was special becuase of her mother as well as Bob, then maybe Muirfield might have wanted to use Vanessa's body for their own perverted beast genetic research OR wanted to harvest her organs for their experiments. So Bob moved the body, in order to keep them from learning Vanessa's genetic secrets that might have made them take to pursuing Cat, her daughter. There were certainly multiple loose threads left from Season 1, particularly why Evan referenced Vincent knowing about "her parents" PLURAL, meaning something else about Vanessa as well, in "Heart of Darkness." But with new showrunners and a new direction in Season 2, those threads have never been picked back up, other than Bob Reynolds. So I guess we will just have to wait and see if Vanessa was part of anything else that we need to know about or why Bob felt it necessary to move her corpse. Wow. This is just. too. much. But maybe you could write a fan-fic.
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